From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Sat Oct 7 14:29:27 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Saturday, October 7 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1057 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Tracs fsj: LT vs.P Re: fsj: Tracs fsj: Re: fsj Tires fsj: Re: 4350 update fsj: RE: Re: 4350 update fsj: [Fwd: Your J-10 for sale.] fsj: Re: 4350 update fsj: Holley carbs fsj: John's new Cherokee fsj: the 77 Wagoneer fsj: I just put the 1983 300SD on ebay Re: fsj: tires - P235's are lookin' good... Re: fsj: the 77 Wagoneer fsj: 84 GW 360 Vac Diagram in MR 253? fsj: h w ar y u? FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 12:33:06 -0500 From: "Landon Tesar" Subject: fsj: Tracs I bet you could get that with an 8-Track as well. - - L ================ Date: Thu, 05 Oct 2000 20:47:13 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: 1979 JEEP CHEROKEE At 03:35 PM 10/5/00 -0700, Fronheiser, Donald H wrote: >More questions afraid they got lost in that last e:mail > > >is it possible to have widetrac/quadratrac both option on truck? absolutely. :) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 12:36:58 -0500 From: "Landon Tesar" Subject: fsj: LT vs.P My question is: Should I get the LT235 75R15s or the P235 75R15s? The siping is wider on the LTs but supposedly the Ps work just as well. Costco has a coupon special for $40 off any Michelin set and the guy -at- Costco said the P235s would be quieter and better for the GW. Comments, please. Thanks, pk - ---------------- My understanding from the Goodyear dealer where I bought the Cooper's, is that 'LT' for Light Truck has a better sidewall construction, and more resistance to tears/scrapes externally. It's a significantly better tire. - - Landon ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 10:42:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Tracs A: Geez! Now you've done it! I have to drive to Canada and back shortly (with no tunes I might add!), and I read this, just as my buddy rolls up with his 8 track playing "I've been everywhere man!" Now I'll be running "This Jeep's an 8-track, quadratrack, Widetrack, tire in the back..." and be adding more as I go (unless distracted by the I-5 corridor traffic!) Landon wrote: I bet you could get that with an 8-Track as well. - - L ================ Date: Thu, 05 Oct 2000 20:47:13 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: 1979 JEEP CHEROKEE At 03:35 PM 10/5/00 -0700, Fronheiser, Donald H wrote: More questions afraid they got lost in that last e:mail is it possible to have widetrac/quadratrac both option on truck? absolutely. :) ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 EFax:603-215-1688 http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 17:56:24 GMT From: "michel balea" Subject: fsj: Re: fsj Tires i picked the LT tires, the P may wear off faster i think, those FSJs are heavy. And you get additionnal side plies (2), which let the tire handle larger pressure Or go for a slightly larger size 30 x 9.5 -no need of lift- Cheers Michel 74 wag _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 14:25:56 -0400 From: "Ray (lists)" Subject: fsj: Re: 4350 update I also discovered that Holley jets > don't fit and there is apparently no source for Motorcraft jets. This carb > is still running rich and there seems to be no cure since I can't find jets > and/or metering rods. It's kind of a kluge, but you can braze the holes shut, mill or file the surrounding areas flat, then drill a new hole. Or, if you know a machinist, it would be no trick to make a couple dozen of them at various sizes. Trick #3: Drill the holes bigger and set up a metering needle that can be inserted or retracted. This will allow you to adjust the carb without changing jets. Of course, the best possible solution is to go with fuel injection :-) Ray ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 11:45:14 -0700 From: "Mike D'Ambrogia" Subject: fsj: RE: Re: 4350 update for motorcraft jets try recarbco -at- (925)439-7030/1- 800-282-CARB. http://www.recarbco.com > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Ray > (lists) > Sent: Friday, October 06, 2000 11:26 AM > To: Brazzadog-at-aol.com; fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: Re: 4350 update > > > I also discovered that Holley jets > > don't fit and there is apparently no source for Motorcraft jets. This > carb > > is still running rich and there seems to be no cure since I can't find > jets > > and/or metering rods. > > It's kind of a kluge, but you can braze the holes shut, mill or file the > surrounding areas flat, then drill a new hole. > > Or, if you know a machinist, it would be no trick to make a > couple dozen of > them at various sizes. > > Trick #3: > Drill the holes bigger and set up a metering needle that can be > inserted or > retracted. This will allow you to adjust the carb without changing jets. > > > Of course, the best possible solution is to go with fuel injection :-) > > > Ray ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 14:42:40 -0500 From: "R.J. Baynum" Subject: fsj: [Fwd: Your J-10 for sale.] Hi! Glad to see you on the list! By the way guys, This is in Huntsville Alabama... Sweet paint and body work! R.J. Received: from mail14.bellsouth.net (mail14.bellsouth.net [209.215.32.162]) by mail0.lig.bellsouth.net (3.3.5alt/0.75.2) with ESMTP id OAA16910 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2000 14:52:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law-f197.hotmail.com [209.185.130.107]) by mail14.bellsouth.net (3.3.5alt/0.75.2) with ESMTP id OAA20426 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2000 14:56:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Oct 2000 11:50:24 -0700 Received: from 208.166.120.150 by lw1fd.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Oct 2000 18:50:23 GMT X-Originating-IP: [208.166.120.150] From: "Michael Baker" To: poolcues-at-bellsouth.net Cc: 1FSJ-at-egroups.com Subject: Re: Your J-10 for sale. Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 18:50:23 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Oct 2000 18:50:24.0233 (UTC) FILETIME=[49122590:01C02FC6] X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 0.97b X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain All, My father bought a new truck and passed his 1979 J10 down to me. I'm a CJ man myself but used the truck this summer to haul materials to a youth camp about 50 miles from my home. Originally, I was going to keep it but we are having our second child and I've decided to sell it and buy another CJ or possibly a Wagoneer. As I said it is a 1979 J10, with the 258 inline six, and a 3-speed manual transmission. It runs great and the body is very solid. My dad had it re-painted about two years ago. I don't know that much about full-sizes Jeeps, all my experience being with CJs. It doesn't have AC and I was wondering what I should be asking for it? Thanks, Mike _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. [demime 0.97b removed an attachment of type image/pjpeg which had a name of j10a.jpg] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 18:08:08 EDT From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Re: 4350 update In a message dated 10/6/00 11:30:10 AM Pacific Daylight Time, RayLists-at-quixnet.net writes: > I also discovered that Holley jets > > don't fit and there is apparently no source for Motorcraft jets. This > carb > > is still running rich and there seems to be no cure since I can't find > jets > > and/or metering rods. > > It's kind of a kluge, but you can braze the holes shut, mill or file the > surrounding areas flat, then drill a new hole. That's beyond my tooling, know-how, and patience. Maybe with some JB Weld... > Or, if you know a machinist, it would be no trick to make a couple dozen of > them at various sizes. This I could do. Anybody know where I can find a 1.97 mm drill? > Trick #3: > Drill the holes bigger and set up a metering needle that can be inserted or > retracted. This will allow you to adjust the carb without changing jets. The 4350 comes with metering rods already. > Of course, the best possible solution is to go with fuel injection :-) That's a good solution, but definitely at the other end of the budget spectrum from the $75 carb I started with. I went back to the Ford dealer today and found a parts man that actually knew parts. He said that when Ford built Motorcraft parts for Jeep, they made sure parts where not interchangeable. He said Holley jets fit in a Ford application Motorcraft carb but not in a Jeep Motorcraft carb. I think he may be right. I'm gonna go check my 2 Motorcraft 4350s and see if the jets are different. This might be an angle that allows me an opportunity to waste more time on this carb. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 18:12:01 EDT From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Holley carbs I checked out the Holley website hoping it would help me identify which 4v is sitting on my workbench. No luck. Anybody know a resource for this? They had a long list of literature but it was hard to tell which ones might be best. Any ideas? Ben Williams '71 Wagoneer '78 F-250 4x4 '88 Bronco ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 17:39:28 -0700 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: John's new Cherokee Since we're talking about relatively rare Tonka Jeeps, check out this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=457034927 I've always seen the early'60's "rhino chaser" Tonka wags... this one looks like a '71! Even has the wood side trim. (Beware... it's green). Clark Novak 87 GW ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2000 19:16:36 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: the 77 Wagoneer http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/39363146 one more day, it's up to $510... just hope that the auctions on yahoo are as credible as ebay... I think the current high bidder is in Missouri!! Hope he knows what he's getting into... or better yet, I hope for a local bidder to win at the last minute. :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 22:49:12 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: I just put the 1983 300SD on ebay I did it... I just put the '83 300SD up on ebay... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=461175817 more pix at: http://www.wagoneers.com/83-300SD/ http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/dieseljohn/ It's located just north of Seattle. I didn't make the offer on ebay, but there is the possiblity that I'd drive it to South Dakota and fly home... maybe even down to the bay area... either location is negotiable and depends on the costs involved. I opened the bidding at $5,995 because that's what I owe on it... Hurry up and buy this thing so I can get concrete in my shop, paint on my J10, new springs on the J10 and the picket fence installed that Old Blue wiped out in '96... ;) Hey, if someone don't buy it, I'll just have to suffer with it... . The wife still refuses to get rid of her little wagoneer, even though it gets worse mileage than my J10 and has started having some problems at over 200,000 miles. (the crank position sensor is going again... so it shuts off when it feels like it. :) I'd love to keep the Benz, but with 4 drivers the insurance costs are almost as much as I'm opening with the Benz! After adding the 300SD to my insurance my total went up to $4,859.00 a year!!! And that's with increased deductibles and not fully covering all vehicles... When both kids are gone in a couple years I'll be able to go back to three vehicles... and then I'll get me an '85 300CD. :) Of course the insurance is cheaper on my J10... :) The 300SD is a great family car, plenty of room in the back seat and a large trunk. I wish I'd gotten one of them about 5 years ago instead of the little wagoneer. But what did I know back then anyway? ;) At this point we're mostly a Jeep family. (67 J3000, 83 J10 Stepside and the 88 xj wagoneer... oh yeah, and the non-licensed 77 Wagoneer, but it's being sold on Yahoo... auction closes this weekend.) Hope you have a great weekend. I'm going to finish the bumper and auxillary fuel tank install on SuperDawg, if the weather isn't ugly... thanx for your time, john meister snohomish, washington - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ "The truth which makes men free is for the most part the truth which men prefer not to hear." ---Herbert Sebastian Agar Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 23:15:18 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: tires - P235's are lookin' good... At 10:26 PM 10/6/00 -0700, Paul & Megan Kershner wrote: >John, >I've read all the lists recommendations on tires and the one thing they all >say is get the LT version because of the extra 2 plys. Should I get the >LT235s or the 30x9.5x15? Rob Harrison (RKH911) says he doesn't have a lift >kit and his 31x10.5s don't rub unless he is in the tightest turns. The >LT235s are $84 each and the 30x9.5s are close to $100 each. The only >4-wheeling I plan on doing is getting out of trouble when I go camping and I >will eventually pull a light utility trailer that I want to outfit for >camping. The advantage of the larger tires is increased ground clearance. I've wheeled fine with "puny little tires" on a variety of Jeeps. It just takes more skill, a stronger skid plate and an occassional ride on a cable if you get too serious about wheeling. :) If you're not gonna do the hard core rock crawling mud traveling stream crossing drive it over anything in your way type of driving, go with what won't require a lift, regearing or hurt your economy and performance. :) As far as the P vs. the LT issue. I've had both. The P definetly has a nicer ride, but it doesn't hold up when driving through brush or sharp objects. :) The P will give you better mileage as well, they're lighter. The P series is what typically comes on Jeeps stock. Even my J10 came stock with P225 or P235 tires! (the Honcho's came with something larger) I'm looking at this $40 off coupon from Costco and the Michelin literature, and wrestling with this issue too... I want to go to 33x9.5 BFG AT's (or the ProComp M/T's) on one hand and P235 LTX A/T (108S XL)'s on the other... the XL is a heavier duty version of the P235's, haven't seen the specs, but both Costco and Discount have mentioned this path to me before. It might be the solution to your light duty towing... but remember, the manufacturer spec'd that thing with P225's! I'm trying to decide what to do to improve the ride on SuperDawg. On Old Blue I had the Michelin LTX P235/75r 15s and had a superb ride. The ride had a quality that was not far from my 300D... of course there were some bumps that reminded you that you were on leaf springs, but 80% of the time the ride was better because of the body on frame design... and I'm sure the 235s had a lot to do with it. SuperDawg has the LT versions of the LTX and I can't get the ride to even come close to Old Blue or even a car! I know that the P series will ride better than the LT series. I think I've proved that to myself after owning both kinds in the LTX line. I originally had 235's on the little wagoneer and then moved them to Old Blue, or was it the other way around? Anyway, the same tires lived on both rigs. While 31's will probably fit on your Wagoneer I'd discourage it for two reasons: 1) without a lift it looks really, really dumb 2) it will adversely affect performance and economy. I have 31x10.5's on SuperDawg right now. I moved from P235's of some off brand. I noticed a drop in economy and power. I'm also thinking of going with 30x9.5's of either the BFG or ProComp variety. I don't know what to do and have until the 8th to make up my mind or lose the $40 discount... :) It gets more complicated because I'm going to be taking the 31x10.5's and putting them on the little wagoneer (it's undergeared right now by 3%, in other words I have too small of tires on it... ;), and then taking the 30x9.5's and putting them on my son's 67 J3000 as his tires are terrifying. The net result is that it's unnecessary on my part as both of my jeeps have basically new treads... but this is a way of getting my son some safe tires cheap and getting the little wagoneer dialed in. AND, improving the ride on Superdawg, along with the fuel economy. I'm going to be working on the rear bumper and auxillary fuel setup tomorrow and will trial fit a P235 and a 30x9.5 on Superdawg and see how it'll look. The 31's look pretty nice... at this point as gasoline approaches $2 bucks a gallon and my selling the Diesel auto, I'd rather it look like it was on roller skates and get the fuel economy up and also get a car like ride... I can always get a set of big ugly noisy gnarly off-road type used tires and mount 'em on extra rims for the times I feel like intimidating traffic. :) With 2 inches of spring lift and 2 inches of body lift the J10 would still sit taller than most vehicles, even if I took the wheels off... ;) Hey, it's almost 11:30, I wonder if the Northern Lights are running tonight... they weren't last night... figures, I was ready for 'em. :) Anyway, bottom line, I'd recommend the P series 235 for your wag, and I'll probably be doing the same thing on my J10. When you stop by tomorrow we can demonstrate the size differences on my J10, I've got a set of 4 P235 studded snows on 6 hole rims under the house and a set of BFG 30x9.5's on 6 holes laying around too... (on my trailer and spares for the J10 and trailer). later, john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ "The truth which makes men free is for the most part the truth which men prefer not to hear." ---Herbert Sebastian Agar Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 03:59:35 -0500 From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: the 77 Wagoneer john said: {- http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/39363146 {- one more day, it's up to $510... just hope {- that the auctions on yahoo are as credible as ebay... {- I think the current high bidder is in Missouri!! Hope he {- knows what he's getting into... or better yet, I hope for {- a local bidder to win at the last minute. :) That's the one that looks almost exactly like my '74, except probably in better condition... Well, the interior and exterior, anyway. For guts, the '74 has a nice 401, no cat or other emissions stuff required (just has a glasspack), and the TH400 got rebuilt right after I got it. :) Gotta get some of the '85 interior parts swapped in... I also have too many projects going on. :) But that's my only real car project. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thunder is a rich source of loudness. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org ----------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 12:49:46 EDT From: BLW1540-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: 84 GW 360 Vac Diagram in MR 253? Can anyone provide a page number in the MR 253 shop manual in which a comprehensive vacuum diagram for the 360 comparable to that for the 6 found on page B-344 can be found? Bruce Wilson 84 GW Des Moines, IA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2000 15:09:00 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: h w ar y u? I w s ni e t h ar f om y u. We th r i n ce her t o. N ce h w el th in er t w rk f r l ng di tanc co mun cat ons, i n't i ? l te , j hn :) - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ "The truth which makes men free is for the most part the truth which men prefer not to hear." ---Herbert Sebastian Agar Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1057 **************************