From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Fri Jul 6 10:35:27 2001 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Friday, July 6 2001 Volume 01 : Number 1368 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [Re: fsj: Re: 1987 jeep grand wagoneer ] fsj: Seasoned advice Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... fsj: Re: fenders fsj: RE: [FSJ-List] stereo suggestions? Re: fsj: attachments on the lists... fsj: Sanyo Quality Re: fsj: More transfer case talk Re: [fsj: Re: 1987 jeep grand wagoneer] FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 6 Jul 2001 08:48:36 MDT From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [Re: fsj: Re: 1987 jeep grand wagoneer ] Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) wrote: > A: It depended on when the ran out of them -at-'87. '84 and '85 were > getting D44 with tow package I recall (but I could be wrong. My '84 J10 > is M20, and so was Elmo ('83 Cherokee) and even though Elmo ran from > Smokey point to Canada with zero oil inside, it worked fine! (Still > does, but the airport is complaining about the whining noise!) Maybe, but my 86 has 3.31 gears and non-lockup A727 which suggests a tow package (front end collision evidence, I think they forgot to put the tranny cooler back on). But it has an AMC 20. My 85 is definitely a tow package with factory tranny cooler, non-lockup trans and 3.31 gears, also an AMC 20. Friend of mine has an 87 with 3.31's and possible evidence of tow package. Also AMC 20. Would be interesting to find out if there was any rhyme or reason... Mic - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 10:06:30 -0500 From: Landon Tesar Subject: fsj: Seasoned advice This is why I like the digest. There are plenty of perspectives that can be compared. Even my own advice is questionable, I know there are others who will 'round it out.' And, if necessary, we can agree to disagree. - - Landon > >i don't know who to believe but i figure your answers are the best any > >help you could give me would be a great help > > I know it's hard to get good info. Sometimes advice you get out there on > the internet needs to be > "seasoned" a bit. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 08:54:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Alexander Wall Subject: Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... What about Slick-50? I have been putting a quart of that into each oil change the last 4 or 5 changes. I haven't noticed any negative effect, but not any real positive one, either. I don't wnat to kill a still-working engine, though. I have 183,000 miles on my engine. Alex - --- James Blair wrote: > A: For the luvva Jeep DON'T put Dura Goop in your nearly new engine! I > have ruined 3 motors with that crud personally and witnessed a fleet of > Toyota diesels destroyed by that crap! Sure it lowers the temp of your > motor, but around here where there is emission testing, I have seen the > results for myself. > My wife's '85 Toyota Tercel, which ran perfectly and passed the > emission test with flying colors a month prior, failed the CO at idle > (from running too cold, even with a highway run and 195 thermostat in > it. Fuel economy dropped like a rock from 35 to 20 mpg. No other changes > other than Dura Lump put in) until I disconnected the cooing fan and put > a sheet of cardboard in front of the rad and ran it till it was in the > red zone, and it barely passed) A month later it started burning oil, > even though compression was 180 across the board. I sold it rather than > rebuild it, because it requires boring oversize to get rid of the crap > or the rings won't seat! > My '72 Ford pickup with 390 ran well before getting Duralube (It got > it the same time as the Tercel or I would have known better) and ran > like crap after, dropping from 17 to 8 mpg and it failed the E test, > even after rebuilding the carb (speaking of carbs, I rebuilt my friend's > '76 Wag 360 2 bbl Motorcraft recently, and used a Borg Warner $16 kit > (#10035D) which had all the basic gaskets and the power valve while > different works well. They get 15 mpg with it {I got 14 mpg highway > before the powervalve went, and it dropped to 8 mpg}, and it passed > Oregon DEQ E-test. I'm not sure what is in the $85 kit that is specific > for AMC 360 that makes it so expensive, but this one seems to work > fine!) > My ex-boss in Canada had a fleet of Toyota diesel delivery trucks he > tried Duralube in 1/2 them. At first it acted as claimed for a couple > months, so he put it in the rest. With a month, the first batch started > burning oil and needed ether to start cold! Then the second batch had > the same trouble. We took the motors apart, and could not find any > reason for it, and reassembled 3 (which never seated the rings) before > the machine shop told us we were wasting our time. > They refused to rebuild Duralube treated motors for customers anymore > because of comebacks (95%) unless they were bored oversized and hot > tanked (tanking alone doesn't even clean that crap off! The cylinder > hone leaves no marks either) > Go with the synthetic oil (I only add Bi-tron when a motor is near > the end of it's useful life to get a little more out of it. I definitely > wouldn't put it in a motor with less than 5000 miles on it! I did treat > my wife's '99 Ranger 3.0L with it at 10,000 miles and got 2 mpg better > average, which is 10% for that one!) > > From: "R.J. Baynum" > > Thanks John! > I got the oil changed today after it's break in period, , a little late, > around 600 miles though.. ( at Express oil change.. cause I don't have > time , with work right now.. using the truck as a everyday work, > (landscaping, grass maint. ) By the way.. I left a flyer with a guy who > had a 70 Blue J-10 Honcho, (bad oxidized paint.. but the decal is > different of course, He probably thought I was a nut case... > I did not have enough money at the time for synthetic oil, and they did > not have enough syn/dino blend.. ( which is better? ) > Also it's not too late to put any Dura-lube or anything like that in it > yet is it? I would love to hear your thoughts as well as the others on > the lists ( I'll forward to.. ) > Thanks! > R.J. > > ************************************* > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche > http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ > http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998 > ************************************** ===== Alexander Wall Spokane, WA ***************************** "Where there's a will, there's a way." Where there's a way, there's a construction crew disrupting traffic! ***************************** Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 12:17:00 -0400 (EDT) From: David Charles Gedraitis Subject: Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... I have used slick fifty and found it works well. I haven't done any specific testing, but for a long time I had a noisy hydraulic lifter in my '61 chrysler, and I did an oil change and added some slick 50, ten minutes later, that lifter quieted right down. Later on of course, I made sure it would never be noisy again by installing a new cam with solid lifters, (more performance :-), and they say setting valve lash is a lost art... ~dave smokin' 40 year old tires in massachusetts On Fri, 6 Jul 2001, Alexander Wall wrote: > What about Slick-50? I have been putting a quart of that into each oil change the last > 4 or 5 changes. I haven't noticed any negative effect, but not any real positive one, > either. I don't wnat to kill a still-working engine, though. I have 183,000 miles on > my engine. > > Alex > > --- James Blair wrote: > > A: For the luvva Jeep DON'T put Dura Goop in your nearly new engine! I > > have ruined 3 motors with that crud personally and witnessed a fleet of > > Toyota diesels destroyed by that crap! Sure it lowers the temp of your > > motor, but around here where there is emission testing, I have seen the > > results for myself. > > My wife's '85 Toyota Tercel, which ran perfectly and passed the > > emission test with flying colors a month prior, failed the CO at idle > > (from running too cold, even with a highway run and 195 thermostat in > > it. Fuel economy dropped like a rock from 35 to 20 mpg. No other changes > > other than Dura Lump put in) until I disconnected the cooing fan and put > > a sheet of cardboard in front of the rad and ran it till it was in the > > red zone, and it barely passed) A month later it started burning oil, > > even though compression was 180 across the board. I sold it rather than > > rebuild it, because it requires boring oversize to get rid of the crap > > or the rings won't seat! > > My '72 Ford pickup with 390 ran well before getting Duralube (It got > > it the same time as the Tercel or I would have known better) and ran > > like crap after, dropping from 17 to 8 mpg and it failed the E test, > > even after rebuilding the carb (speaking of carbs, I rebuilt my friend's > > '76 Wag 360 2 bbl Motorcraft recently, and used a Borg Warner $16 kit > > (#10035D) which had all the basic gaskets and the power valve while > > different works well. They get 15 mpg with it {I got 14 mpg highway > > before the powervalve went, and it dropped to 8 mpg}, and it passed > > Oregon DEQ E-test. I'm not sure what is in the $85 kit that is specific > > for AMC 360 that makes it so expensive, but this one seems to work > > fine!) > > My ex-boss in Canada had a fleet of Toyota diesel delivery trucks he > > tried Duralube in 1/2 them. At first it acted as claimed for a couple > > months, so he put it in the rest. With a month, the first batch started > > burning oil and needed ether to start cold! Then the second batch had > > the same trouble. We took the motors apart, and could not find any > > reason for it, and reassembled 3 (which never seated the rings) before > > the machine shop told us we were wasting our time. > > They refused to rebuild Duralube treated motors for customers anymore > > because of comebacks (95%) unless they were bored oversized and hot > > tanked (tanking alone doesn't even clean that crap off! The cylinder > > hone leaves no marks either) > > Go with the synthetic oil (I only add Bi-tron when a motor is near > > the end of it's useful life to get a little more out of it. I definitely > > wouldn't put it in a motor with less than 5000 miles on it! I did treat > > my wife's '99 Ranger 3.0L with it at 10,000 miles and got 2 mpg better > > average, which is 10% for that one!) > > > > From: "R.J. Baynum" > > > > Thanks John! > > I got the oil changed today after it's break in period, , a little late, > > around 600 miles though.. ( at Express oil change.. cause I don't have > > time , with work right now.. using the truck as a everyday work, > > (landscaping, grass maint. ) By the way.. I left a flyer with a guy who > > had a 70 Blue J-10 Honcho, (bad oxidized paint.. but the decal is > > different of course, He probably thought I was a nut case... > > I did not have enough money at the time for synthetic oil, and they did > > not have enough syn/dino blend.. ( which is better? ) > > Also it's not too late to put any Dura-lube or anything like that in it > > yet is it? I would love to hear your thoughts as well as the others on > > the lists ( I'll forward to.. ) > > Thanks! > > R.J. > > > > ************************************* > > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche > > http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ > > http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998 > > ************************************** > > > ===== > Alexander Wall > Spokane, WA > > ***************************** > "Where there's a will, there's a way." > Where there's a way, there's a construction crew disrupting traffic! > ***************************** > Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 09:38:04 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: transfer case question, and the news... At 11:07 AM 7/6/01 -0500, R.J. Baynum wrote: >oops... >well, I will do to that next time.. >That is rather heavy.. isn't it? not for that kind of heat. >Does a new engine need that? oil too thin wears 'em out... >R.J. > >john wrote: > > > > At 01:02 AM 7/6/01 -0500, R.J. Baynum wrote: > > >What about the weight? I had them put in 10-30,, is that right? not 10-40? > > > > in the xfr case or the engine? > > > > the engine should have 20w50... :) > > > > john > > > > >oil has come a long way theses days.. there are so many choices, it's > > >confusing.. > > > > > >Thanks! > > >R.J. > > > > > > > > >john wrote: > > > > > > > > At 12:16 AM 7/6/01 -0500, R.J. Baynum wrote: > > > > >Thanks John! > > > > >I got the oil changed today after it's break in period, , a little > late, > > > > >around > > > > >600 miles though.. ( at Express oil change.. cause I don't have time , > > > > >with work > > > > >right now.. using the truck as a everyday work, (landscaping, grass > > > maint. ) > > > > >By the way.. I left a flyer with a guy who had a 70 Blue J-10 > Honcho, (bad > > > > >oxidized paint.. but the decal is different of course, He probably > > > > >thought I was > > > > >a nut case... > > > > > > > > wait till he gets to know you better... > > > > (that'll remove all doubt... rofl... just kidding. :) I'm sure he'll > > > > understand, I've yet > > > > to meet another FSJ type that didn't think they're special. The > only folks > > > > that didn't > > > > were the original owners. :) One of my neighbors had one new, > hated the > > > > mileage, > > > > breakdowns and so on... of course when you pay that much for a > new car > > > > you expect better... > > > > > > > > >I did not have enough money at the time for synthetic oil, and > they did > > > > >not have > > > > >enough syn/dino blend.. ( which is better? ) > > > > > > > > go with a pure synthetic, especially in your climate. if you go with > > > > something other than > > > > amsoil just make sure you stay within reasonable oil change > limits. amsoil > > > > has a 7,500 mile > > > > oil designed for minute lube places. maybe you should sign up as a > dealer > > > > and sell 'em on it > > > > and make some extra bucks. :) just don't quit the day job unless > you're > > > > willing to work it real > > > > hard. this ain't a get rich quick mult-level scheme. :) you ain't > gonna > > > > be selling motivational > > > > tapes and t-shirts, just oil... and remember you're selling an air > filter > > > > that will outlast the car, > > > > that's a one time sale... and selling oil designed to go 25,000 > miles or > > > > one year... hmmm... not > > > > gonna make very often. :) most dealers are in it because they use the > > > > product... saves 'em > > > > .20 to .60 a quart... not much, but helps. :) > > > > > > > > >Also it's not too late to put any Dura-lube or anything like that > in it > > > > >yet is it? > > > > > > > > don't use ANY additives or treatments. save your money and maintain > > > > regular oil and filter changes, > > > > use synthetic if you feel the need to spend money. additives and > > > > treatments, unless recommended > > > > by the oil company of the oil you're using, is going to alter the > > > > characteristics and possibly reduce > > > > their effectiveness... I've heard more horror stories bout > engines dying > > > > from treatments than I've > > > > heard the good, yet unsubstantiated, glory stories... In fact, > I've killed > > > > two engines using additives > > > > and treatments... two. busted a crank on one engine and a camshaft > on the > > > > other... stick with the > > > > oil, regular changes... :) of course, I recommend amsoil... > :) but any > > > > synthetic will do just fine, > > > > and I HIGHLY RECOMMEND the use of synthetic in the AMC 360 V8's. Any > > > > brand. just do it. > > > > it'll help because they run so blasted hot... > > > > > > > > >I would love to hear your thoughts as well as the others on the > lists ( > > > > >I'll forward to.. ) > > > > >Thanks! > > > > >R.J. > > > > > > > > u got it. > > > > john > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/Filter_INFORMATION/air_filter-1.jpg > > > > http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/Filter_INFORMATION/air_filter-2.jpg > > > > FS JEEPs: 360/401: TS-23 258: TS-12 retail $21.50 > > > > xj JEEPS: 4.0L/2.5L('87 and up): TS-29 retail $29.95 > > > > DieselBenz: typical S1118 or S1680 retail $32.50 or $39.85 > > > > http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ order 1-800-956-5695 cust# 283461 > > > > Snohomish, WA, where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > > ------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 09:39:38 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: fenders At 04:02 PM 7/6/01 +0200, Per Lindquist wrote: > "Per Lindquist" <0660.53060-at-telia.com> >Hello!"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> > I have a Jeep Cherokee Chief 1978 (Widetrack) vin J8A17NN049000 , with > rosty rear fenders, so I need rear fenders (or quarters panels). Is it > anything you know there to find, new or used ones? >Sorry for my bad english. > Tanks! >Per Lindquist >Sweden JC whitney has replacement panels, they have a website. Also WillysOverland has parts, not sure of the website. john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 09:43:38 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: [FSJ-List] stereo suggestions? At 07:47 AM 7/6/01 -0500, Johan Forsman wrote: >John: >The new Crutchfield catalog has a couple of Sanyo models in standard (DIN >E?) size that contains both the CD and cassette player. They're $250-$300. I >have not seen any cheaper than that. >Johan. >LSU Geology >Baton Rouge cool, will check it out... size isn't a problem, doing a custom dash in the j10... price is an issue, not sure about sanyo quality though... have a kenwood 5002 right now, will that take a CD and remote??? john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 10:14:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: Re: fsj: attachments on the lists... From: john it has nothing to do with the computers on the receiving end, it's simply a matter of traffic. Any computer that has graphics capability will display pictures. That's not the reason. And yes james, even my UNIX systems will view pictures. Most of the time I'm connected via a non-graphics telnet session. A: I didn't mean yours. There are a couple people on the list that are (or at least were a year ago) unable to see pics because their computers are text only. (they couldn't see the pics I posted on photopoint) Same goes for the internet phone I had a couple years ago. >We set up the lists for the FSJ list from the start without attachments. I can't believe that some of these folks permit attachments... especially with the problems of viruses and such... so we don't permit attachments on this list, or any list I've started, because of some simple math... :) it works quite well this way too. Imagine 500 of your closest Jeep buddies all downloading that latest 256K image or your left rear muddy wheel... If you want to share a picture, put it on a web page and pass the URL, or post that you have such and such a picture and have people email you if they want to see it... :) john A: Free places to park pics on the net are disappearing quickly. Even photopoint charges now (I have to upgrade now because I have too many pics) ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998 ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 13:20:13 -0400 From: mpolkkidodge-at-netscape.net Subject: fsj: Sanyo Quality I had a Sanyo in the CJ-5 I had, It worked great. I think it is a good player. I don't know if the steering wheel remote is available for it though. Mike ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 10:22:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: Re: fsj: More transfer case talk A: Definitely crawl under there and make sure everything is allright and tight! (I almost lost the NP208 in Elmo because I thought the shake was a U joint!) If both seals fail between the trans and case, the case can overfill with fluid till it comes out the top. From: Brian Wall Speaking of transfer cases, hereıs the latest challenge Iıve encountered... On the way home from work last Friday I my rear U-joint went out. Of course, I limped home (slowly) but now know I should have gotten a tow. Why? (some of you probably already know). Because I went to put the drive shaft with new U-joints back in yesterday and found a nice big puddle of fluid under the front of my NP228 (where it meets the tranny). In hindsight Iım sure all that vibration wasnıt good on it. I just wasnıt thinking about that when I drove home. Do you think itıs anything more than just a leaky seal? I havenıt had the opportunity to check the nuts to see if they came loose anywhere. If it is a seal, how hard is it to change? Also, given the position of the leak, is this fluid from the case itself, or the transmission? Thanks (as always) - - -------------- Brian Wall Oklahoma City 86 GW ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998 ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 10:41:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: Re: [fsj: Re: 1987 jeep grand wagoneer] From: Michael Shimniok john wrote: >>I"m not sure what year the d44 became the std in the GW, '87 may have been it... Mike: >I dunno for sure.   80-85 were the AMC20 years, no D44 rears at all. In 86 there were both D44 and AMC 20 (seen both with my own two eyes). In 87 I know of at least one rig with an AMC 20 but I think there are others with D44 as well. I think by 88 it was all D44, but maybe it took a long time for Chrysler to run out of AMC20 stock? A: I saw an '88 on the lot here in Renton that had a M20 with panhard bar. >FWIW, the panhard bars seem to limit the very small amount of sideways travel that is possible with leaf springs. I've compared, sort of, and it seems the panhard bars generate quicker steering response. Don't know what value they have in the rear. But I much prefer slower steering response esp with a lift. The sway bar of course limits body lean and they are nice to have on twisty mountain roads, but don't ever drive your FSJ like it was a sports car, please. :) A: AWWW! Why not? I drove Elmo that way (my wife's nailmarks from the Mt Rainier trip are probably still in the dash pad too! After she drove it, she decided she didn't like the "loose" feel of the power steering, so I took the PS belt off, and it was fine for her) >Also of note, the front diff vac motor went away after 84, so 85+ have solid front axles with permanently engaged hubs. A: I have also seen several list members with '85 and vac axle. >This is what made true shift-on-the-fly at "any legal speed" possible. A: If it has the pin on the 2WD to 4WD shifter switch, it's a vac front axle stock. After perma-engaging the front axle and rerouting the hoses, the pin can be removed very easily (c-clip and spring) >I guess I'm a dimwit cuz I have hubs on my NP229 equipped rig. :) I inherited it, but I like it. Why spin the driveshaft etc and add that extra bit of friction into the mix... Altho one has to be VERY careful not to engage 4x4 with the hubs unlocked or you'll burn out the limited slip inside. A: It's fine if you go directly to low range because the center carrier is locked, but don't romp on it. Nice thing about this is it gives you 2WD low (especially with my NP208 which is locked front to rear even in 4 hi), and I towed my 5 ton trailer up some nasty, steep, but dry pavement hills with Elmo that way! (just to get rolling, then I popped into neutral, upshifted to 4 hi and popped back into gear. Not for the faint of heart or clumsy! ) Some of those hills were worse than John's driveway! >The hubs only seem to make a difference at highway speeds esp climbing hills (ie, 11,000' passes) where every pony matters. A: It also mattered on a 200,000+ mile straight 6! (I'm almost certain now that the motor I had wasn't a 258, but a 282 from Mexico, which alo explains why all the pistons looked so bad when I pulled it apart!) >The J truck probably originally came with an NP208 and hubs. NP229's are great tcases and probably the most common type (in junkyards you either find QT's or NP229s, others less frequently). They work great in snow and off-road. Maybe not as strong as some, but far stronger than any stock POS slip-yoke tcase such as is found in the YJ's. The low range is lower than most (2.6:1) which is excellent for of(froading) - - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - A: I agree, except maybe the NVG242 HD that the '95ish up 4.0L XJs and Hummers run. The chain in that is wide as a BW QT nearly, and the NVG249 is no slouch either (behind 5.8L GCs) but it's a full time 4x4 unit nless you get a later model and incorporate some NVG242 internal linkage pieces to get 2WD. (I heard about that on the XJ list awhile back) ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998 ************************************** ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1368 **************************