From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Aug 13 00:13:10 2002 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, August 13 2002 Volume 01 : Number 1720 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Aug 11 - Ouray adventure in progress fsj: the irony of it all... fsj: Re: [FSJparts] Call for help!!! On the road to Ouray. fsj: Re: [1FSJ] the irony of it all... fsj: re: coolant leak fsj: side trip fsj: DOH! fsj: Rez is Whining Re: fsj: Rez is Whining fsj: Full Size Jeep Invasion Newsletter [V2/I6] fsj: Bad news Re: fsj: Rez is Whining fsj: Another Casualty fsj: 2 rooms available at Box Canyon Inn fsj: transfercase found fsj: Re: Update - Call for help!! On the road to Ouray Re: fsj: Coolant leak FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 21:33:07 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Aug 11 - Ouray adventure in progress Departed Snohomish around 10am, arrived 9pm Ontario, OR. We're having no problems... getting 16.58 mpg towing the trailer... However, Paul Kershner is in Baker City, OR, his '84 GW is sitting at a tranny shop waiting for it to open in the morning. Seems his transfer case is on the blink. He stopped once to have t looked at the shop found it low on fluid, so the guy put in 80W GEAR LUBE in an NP229... Not sure what's up with it, hoping that the shop will be able to get him going in 2wd at least... suspect the vacuum switch??? either that or the viscous coupler. WILL AN NP229 work in 2wd if the viscous coupler goes out? If you know the answer email curtis at jeepbuilder-at-attbi.com and he'll call me or give you my cell so I can call Paul. Paul is at the Super 8 in Baker City, OR if anyone is coming through. He'll be there in Baker City until at least noon. :) Hope no one else is having troubles getting to Ouray... The big adventure afterwards may be figuring out where everyone broke down. :) signing out for now, john meister - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 21:54:16 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: the irony of it all... I called Curtis via cell phone about Paul Kershner's xfr case troubles here in Eastern Oregon... I asked Curtis to post for info/help on the NP229... and I dial up via my cell at the hotel and voila, here's Curtis's request needing to be approved... rofl... Any way two questions, if you know, email curtis at jeepbuilder-at-attbi.com and he'll email you my cell. During peak time I'll be very short on time, so make it brief if you call, until after 8pm. :) I've got full roaming in the 12 western states... Anyway, Paul is back in Baker City, his Jeep at a trans shop that the tow truck driver said was good. THE QUESTIONS: 1- will an NP229 still work in 2wd if the viscous coupler goes 2- could the vacuum switch/shifter thing cause the transfr case slip? also, is the 228 a direct replacement for the 229.... later, john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 22:03:44 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [FSJparts] Call for help!!! On the road to Ouray. Is Paul Kershner the FIRST on the road to Ouray with an FSJ failure??? I'm not sure he wants the honor... :) I'll call curtis (BRIEFLY) during peak time tomorrow and let him know Paul's status, I should hear from Paul by noon tomorrow... will keep the list posted at night... I may upload a few pictures to the http://wagoneers.com/ouray directory, we'll see... running a 14.4k connection on my cell... ;) might wait until we get to ouray... If you need to get in touch with me get in touch with curtis... BTW, the WJ pulling a 1,400lb trailer is still getting 16.58mpg! :) Can hardly wait to see how much it jumps up when we dump the trailer off in Salt Lake... :) BTW, Mesa Verde is open... RJ called me earlier... later, john At 01:04 AM 8/12/2002 +0000, machinedoc2002 wrote: >Hello List members, > >It would appear that we have our first casualty on the road to >Ouray. A few minutes ago I recieved a call from John Meister (Who is >in NorthEastern Oregon heading east.) looking for assistance for >another fellow list member, Paul K. (Who should be around the 288 >mile marker.) at a rest area. Paul appears to have had a transfer >case failure in his 84 GW. He is now in need of a NP229 (Or suitable >direct replacement) transfer case. If any of you happen to have one >of these handy or available Near Boise ID or NE Oregon please e-mail >me off list at Jeepbuilder-at-attbi.com and I will give you John's >cell phone number. Maybe together we can get Paul back on the road >again. > >Thank's, > >Curtis > > >------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> >4 DVDs Free +s&p Join Now >http://us.click.yahoo.com/pt6YBB/NXiEAA/Ey.GAA/unTolB/TM >---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> > >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >FSJparts-unsubscribe-at-yahoogroups.com > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 22:52:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: fsj: Re: [1FSJ] the irony of it all... A: The NP229 and 228 are only internally different. I'm not 100% sure, but a NP219 should fit as well. With a NP208 he could run in frontwheel drive till he got a longer driveshaft (gently that is! I did 60 mph no problem for 2 weeks with Elmo) Other bolt ins are AMC Eagle transfercases, '82 to '88. (no low range, but the NP229 low range will bolt in with IIRC the rear 1/2 of the case) If the front axle was disenaging while driving (vacuum leaks on long hills will do it) the VC will self destruct. As long as the shift fork wasn't damaged, he should be able to force the shifter into 2 high. Make sure the case oil is changed a couple times. Is he sure it's the case and not the trans? If it's the trans, sitting for a couple hours will make it able to go again sometimes (then clean the pan and filter, put the old fluid back in through a strainer and add STP engine oil treatment) I almost bought an '85 GW today for $400, just so I would have a FSJ, but the V8 would kill me for fuel! From: john-at-wagoneers.com (john) I called Curtis via cell phone about Paul Kershner's xfr case troubles here in Eastern Oregon... I asked Curtis to post for info/help on the NP229... and I dial up via my cell at the hotel and voila, here's Curtis's request needing to be approved... rofl... Any way two questions, if you know, email curtis at jeepbuilder-at-attbi.com and he'll email you my cell. During peak time I'll be very short on time, so make it brief if you call, until after 8pm. :) I've got full roaming in the 12 western states... Anyway, Paul is back in Baker City, his Jeep at a trans shop that the tow truck driver said was good. THE QUESTIONS: 1- will an NP229 still work in 2wd if the viscous coupler goes 2- could the vacuum switch/shifter thing cause the transfr case slip? also, is the 228 a direct replacement for the 229.... later, john ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ Black Jack's before pic: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/jim-b-J10.jpg ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 23:01:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: fsj: re: coolant leak A: Double check the bottom hose clamp didn't cut through the hose (been there, done that!) If it's a used pump, the internal seal may be leaking through the breather hole on the bottom under the pulley and dripping down. If the bearing seems fine, get a bolt to fit the hole, and smear it with black silicone and screw it into the hole (better see if it has a top hole as well) The giveaway is rust stain around the hole! ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ Black Jack's before pic: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/jim-b-J10.jpg ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 23:06:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: fsj: side trip A: I am leaving in a couple minutes to go get my youngest son from BC. We'll be in my wife's dark grey '99 Ranger 4x4 (pic on http://www.picturetrail.com/carnuck ) ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ Black Jack's before pic: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/jim-b-J10.jpg ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 23:08:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck2-at-webtv.net (jim blair) Subject: fsj: DOH! A: Anyone with a transfercase for Paul along the way give me a call at 206-721-1348 I'll be on the road at midnight PST ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ Black Jack's before pic: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/jim-b-J10.jpg ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 06:43:11 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Rez is Whining I don't think the Rez Runner wants to go on this trip. Took a drive yesterday to put some miles on before the first oil change and the brand spanking new power steering pump started whining. Not real loud and not all the time. Sometimes gets worse in a turn. Therefore, I think I'm going to throw in my pully kit and just drive the thing until it gets better or the pump self destructs. I'll just have to see if I can pick up a pump along the road somewhere if that happens. I'm on line through today. Leaving early on Tuesday morning. - --Vince ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 11:25:03 -0500 From: "R.J. Baynum" Subject: Re: fsj: Rez is Whining you just got air in the line or low on fluid.. you need to bleed it..maybe? try sitting and doing the steering wheel frome one end to another , back and forth, and make sure its kept full.. and see if that works.. R.J. Vince Orr wrote: >I don't think the Rez Runner wants to go on this trip. Took a drive yesterday >to put some miles on before the first oil change and the brand spanking new >power steering pump started whining. Not real loud and not all the time. >Sometimes gets worse in a turn. Therefore, I think I'm going to throw in my >pully kit and just drive the thing until it gets better or the pump self >destructs. I'll just have to see if I can pick up a pump along the road >somewhere if that happens. >I'm on line through today. Leaving early on Tuesday morning. >--Vince ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 12:12:56 -0400 From: michael.shimniok-at-usa.net Subject: fsj: Full Size Jeep Invasion Newsletter [V2/I6] - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 2002 FULL SIZE JEEP INVASION NEWSLETTER - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - August 7, 2002 Volume 2, Issue 6 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Contents INTRODUCTION WHAT DO I DO WHEN I GET TO OURAY? WHAT CB CHANNEL OR HAM FREQUENCY DO I USE? WHERE DO I MEET FOR SOCIAL GATHERINGS? WHERE DO I CAMP? CAN I LIGHT A FIRE? WHEN AND WHERE IS THE FRIDAY PICNIC? WHERE AND WHEN IS THE BBQ? WHAT ABOUT THE RAFFLE? HOW ABOUT THE CONTESTS? - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - INTRODUCTION This is the last Invasion Newsletter you'll see since we are less than a week away from the big event at this writing. The purpose of this newsletter is to provide you with all the information you need to go and participate. You need to know about sign-in, trail assignments, where to meet, when to meet, things like that. Well, here goes. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHAT DO I DO WHEN I GET TO OURAY? After you arrive in Ouray, visit the sign-in center in the Community Center, east of Main street on 6th avenue. It doubles as the Walsh Library and the Town Hall. Look for the "Echo Chamber" room once inside. Visit this room during one of the following hours (preferably Wed afternoon or Thursday morning) Wed 1:00pm - 6:00pm Thu 7:00am - 8:00am 7:00pm - 8:00pm Fri 7:00am - 8:00am 7:00pm - 8:00pm Sat 7:00am - 8:00am You'll get a goodie bag with important information as well as some advertising brochures and stickers. You'll pick up your t-shirts bbq tickets, and raffle ticket. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHAT CB CHANNEL OR HAM FREQUENCY DO I USE? For around town or when you arrive, try CB Channel 4. When you get to town, help us monitor this channel, too. If you have an FRS radio, use channel 4 with no privacy codes. If you're a Amateur Radio Operator, use and help us monitor the following frequencies: North: 147.270 PL 127.3 Engineer Pass KB5ITT South: 147.375 PL 156.7 Silverton KC5CHM 146.520 simplex - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHERE DO I MEET FOR SOCIAL GATHERINGS? When you sign in, you'll get a list of meeting times and places with your name associated with a meeting time and place each day. If you want to meet other FSJers there and talk about what you might want to do that day, or just talk, or whatever, feel free. You can also hook up with other people. All up to you. Just be sure to have a fun, relaxing time and meet the people you've been emailing all this time. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHERE DO I CAMP? As far as we know there are no camping restrictions in the Uncompaghre National Forest. The only camp sites that I know of are along the road from Lake City to Cinnamon Pass (way out of the way), at the trailhead of Imogene Pass, on the west side of the road leading to Animas Forks out of Silverton, near the trailhead to Eureka Gulch, and near the trailhead for Clear Lake. Some of these may be closed. You need to call up BLM and or USFS for more info on primitive camping. We understand most of you have selected campgrounds (like KOA or those in Silverton) or other developed campsites. There is a lot of countryside to choose from, quite a few trails in the area with sites nearby. We assume you've already bought a map and done some preliminary searching with a plan to scope out the area when you arrive in town. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - CAN I LIGHT A FIRE? There are fire restrictions in place. We do not want to be the club labelled as starting a massive record setting fire or any kind of fire, so it is up to each of you to be very careful. You will receive a bright pink 6x5" handout explaining the fire restrictions on one side. You must adhere to these. We will not tolerate any violation of these rules. This includes smoking in the car, only; not parking over tall grass or other fammable material, not lighting campfires, and so on. You can visit various websites for fire safety as well. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHEN AND WHERE IS THE FRIDAY PICNIC? To prevent congestion in the area at the recent request of the Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management, meet us on Friday on the way to Animas Forks. Take County Road 110 east from Silverton and follow the signs, keeping an eye out to your left (west) for all the FSJs. Meet us there between noon and 4pm. You can also explore a trail and drive through Animas Forks on the way to the meeting area. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHERE AND WHEN IS THE BBQ? The BBQ dinner will start at 6pm at the Ouray Rotary Park north of town. It is farther north than the Visitor Center by a mile or two. Look for it on the right. There isn't enough parking at the facility so if you don't have a full Jeep, find a ride or pick up 2-3 people. For carpooling, meet in front of the Community Center a little before 6:00pm. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - WHAT ABOUT THE RAFFLE? We may raffle off a couple things at the picnic and will raffle off most stuff at the BBQ. You won't need to be present to win because we know not everyone has signed up for the BBQ. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - HOW ABOUT THE CONTESTS? Prizes for those contests we hold near Animas Forks will be given out before we leave that evening. We'll hand out other contest prizes at the BBQ. If you aren't present, we'll ship the prize to you. Also, due to insurance problems, we are unable to host the RTI and Slow Crawl contests. All other contests are still on. [end] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 11:44:56 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Bad news Was loading up the Rez Runner, got in to start the engine. No dice. Dead ignition system. Near as I can tell, I have power to the coil. Nothing from the coil to the distributor. There is a little thing that looks like a capacitor that is on the same bracket as the coil. How important is that? The wire broke off when I was changing out the engine and I didn't replace it. Could that have caused my coil to fry? - --Vince ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 11:46:09 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Rez is Whining Been there done that. Still whines. Now I have another problem to solve with the ignition system. Looks like I'll be driving the TJ afterall. - --Vince - ----- Original Message ----- From: "R.J. Baynum" To: "Vince Orr" ; Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 11:25 AM Subject: Re: fsj: Rez is Whining > you just got air in the line or low on fluid.. > you need to bleed it..maybe? > try sitting and doing the steering wheel frome one end to another , back > and forth, and make sure > its kept full.. > and see if that works.. > > R.J. > > > Vince Orr wrote: > > >I don't think the Rez Runner wants to go on this trip. Took a drive yesterday > >to put some miles on before the first oil change and the brand spanking new > >power steering pump started whining. Not real loud and not all the time. > >Sometimes gets worse in a turn. Therefore, I think I'm going to throw in my > >pully kit and just drive the thing until it gets better or the pump self > >destructs. I'll just have to see if I can pick up a pump along the road > >somewhere if that happens. > >I'm on line through today. Leaving early on Tuesday morning. > >--Vince ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 14:58:14 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Another Casualty Well guys, I think I've finally met my match.......Rez has beaten me down pretty good. No ignition.......I've been testing and trouble shooting all day without any luck at all. I'm starting to think I have a failure in either the brain box or the new distributor but at this point I'm so tired and disappointed, I think I'm going to have a stiff drink and just take a leisurely week at home. Got the whip antenna on this morning, wired up the radio, packed all my tools and stuff, vacuumed out all the dirt, and checked the fluids one last time. Was going to leave in the early AM tomorrow. My daughter and I are really bummed out to say the least. I could come over in the TJ but I don't think I could stand it. I think instead, I'll take it easy and perhaps see if I can find the problem with Rez. I had to cancel my tent site at the KOA. If you need a campsite, move fast and you can get mine. They have a three day cancellation policy so I'm probably going to get socked for one night anyway. Well, I hope everyone has a good time. I'll be there in spirit. - --Vince Orr '81 Dead in the Driveway Wagoneer ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 14:43:42 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: 2 rooms available at Box Canyon Inn tonight till sat Under Zach Heisy (he can't go) http://www.virtualjeep.com/ Black Jack and other pics ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 14:56:50 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: transfercase found I went to my buddy's scrapyard, and scored a NP228 for $300. (I don't really need it, but he figured he owed me a deal for stuff I dropped off) I also got 2 904 auto trans (one from a 6 cyl and one from a 4 cyl with EFI) and the parts I need to convert my MJ to auto later (so my wife can drive it with her messed up leg) http://www.virtualjeep.com/ Black Jack and other pics ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 01:15:28 +0000 From: Machinedoc-at-attbi.com Subject: fsj: Re: Update - Call for help!! On the road to Ouray Hi Everybody, After a busy morning and the help of several list members Paul should be getting back on the road sometime today. Last I talked to him this morning he had located a t/c and it should be installed sometime today. I hope to hear from him soon that he is underway once again. I also hope and pray that the remainder of the trip is uneventful, not only for him (And his family), but for everyone that is undertaking the journey to Ouray. Everybody Be careful, be safe, and have a great time. Thank's, Curtis > > Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 00:44:44 +0000 > From: Machinedoc-at-attbi.com > Subject: fsj: Call for help!! On the road to Ouray > > Hello List members, > > It would appear that we have our first casualty on the > road to Ouray. A few minutes ago I recieved a call from > John Meister (Who is in NorthEastern Oregon heading > east.) looking for assistance for another fellow list > member (Who should be around the 288 mile marker.) at a > rest area. Paul appears to have had a transfer case > failure in his GW. He is now in need of a NP229 (Or > suitable direct replacement) transfer case. If any of > you happen to have one of these handy or available Near > Boise ID or NE Oregon please e-mail me off list and I > will give you John's cell phone number. He hopes to be > in Boise for the night in about 2 hours or so. Maybe > together we can get Paul back on the road again. > > Thank's, > > Curtis ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 20:07:53 -0600 From: Gary Clark Subject: Re: fsj: Coolant leak Alex, The bolt may pass into the water jacket for the engine, in which case the threads of the bolt will need to be sealed with gasket cement when installed. Some bolts, but not all the bolts can enter the water jacket. I am not sure about the AMC engines and water pumps, it has been a long time since I replaced mine, but this sounds like a place to start. Good luck, Gary 73 Wag > is dripping heavily out from one of the bolt holes, and apparently from BEHIND > the wheel with the > timing mark on it. > I don't even know where to go from here. Any help would be welcome!! > > Thanks, > > Alex > Spokane, WA > '84 Wagoneer "Lucky" > > > ===== > Alexander Wall > Spokane, WA > ============================================================================== > === > "Where there's a will, there's a way." - Eliza Cook > "Where there's a way, there's a construction crew disrupting traffic!" - Alex > Wall > ============================================================================== > === > HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs > http://www.hotjobs.com ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1720 **************************