From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Wed Sep 4 12:28:03 2002 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Wednesday, September 4 2002 Volume 01 : Number 1739 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: two trac-locks? fsj: Re: two trac-locks? fsj: Re: labor day 2002 - the pictures Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build fsj: Tornado talkin' fsj: birds? Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 23:52:04 -0500 From: JeepNut Subject: fsj: two trac-locks? Someone from another list I'm on said he had a D30 up front and a D44 in rear with limited slip in each and was wondering if this would be a good pair up for offroading... Haven't I heard on one of these lists that this isn't good in slippery conditions? It seemed like I had read that it makes your truck walk off the roadway in snowy/slippery roads, or causes a spin... or am I dreaming again...... Seems I recall it was said with a tracloc rear you'd have to use a locker in front so it could be disengaged for highway driving. Anyone else have knowledge of this?? Thanks, JeepNut - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee - ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 21:52:40 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: two trac-locks? At 11:52 PM 9/2/2002 -0500, JeepNut wrote: >Someone from another list I'm on said he had a D30 up front >and a D44 in rear with limited slip in each and was >wondering if this would be a good pair up for offroading... yep. I had a True-Trac in the front and a Detroit Locker that I removed and replaced with the factory Trac Lock... this is a good setup for both on and off road... the Detroit locker is NOT street friendly, but awesome off-road. The True-Trac in the front is outstanding, worked great on and off road. >Haven't I heard on one of these lists that this isn't good >in slippery conditions? In ice or snow having open axles is often preferred. It's been my experience that with L/S on ice covered roads that are crowned or sloped that you tend to leave the road by way of the slope... :) I've heard the guys running in Montana prefer open diffs... This is where an Ox locker or ARB locker is a good setup... :) I'm hoping they get the electric lockup true-tracs working... that's probably what I'll use in SuperDawg. >It seemed like I had read that it makes your truck walk off >the roadway in snowy/slippery roads, or causes a spin... or >am I dreaming again...... nope, been there, done that... we had some ice and I had my hands full with the little wagoneer with only l/s in the rear... Old Blue had Quadratrac and open diffs and ice wasn't even the slightest problem... :) >Seems I recall it was said with a tracloc rear you'd have to >use a locker in front so it could be disengaged for highway >driving. Lockers in the front, unless ARB or Ox locker, are not really recommended... a limited slip in the front is preferred... you'll find out the first time you try to make a tight turn on a tight trail. ;) >Anyone else have knowledge of this?? > Thanks, JeepNut :) john - ----------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://wagoneers.com http://wagoneers.com/johns-vehicles.html '83 J10 stepside (SJ) - http://wagoneers.com/SuperDawg '99 Grand Cherokee Ltd (WJ) - http://wagoneers.com/WJ '67 J-100 Panel (SJ) - http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/johns-67-Panel/ '77 Cherokee (SJ) - http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/johns-77-cherokee '76 Datsun 280Z - http://www.wagoneers.com/tmp/280Z/ (for sale) '67 Ford Fairlane - http://www.wagoneers.com/ebay/fairlane/ (for sale) '54 Chevy box... almost a trailer... (for sale) Snohomish, WA, where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... ----------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 00:07:32 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: Re: labor day 2002 - the pictures Speaking of birds, we saw a blackbird with white wing stripes in Ouray. Anyone know what it was? - ----- Original Message ----- From: john Sent: Monday, September 02, 2002 9:37 PM To: Subject: labor day 2002 - the pictures http://www.wagoneers.com/fotos/BeckysGarden/LaborDay-2002/ I installed the shutters my wife made... and fixed the pond... all before the rain returned... :) http://www.wagoneers.com/fotos/BeckysGarden/LaborDay-2002/ALL-laborday2002.jp g http://www.wagoneers.com/fotos/BeckysGarden/Aug-2002-Birds/ (the woodpecker is a male Northern Flicker - thanx to my friend up in BC... I never know what these birds or plants are called... I just take the pictures and enjoy the beauty. :) BTW, the auction on ebay is really doing well, helping a friend sell his car... the car used in a Stallone movie... :) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1855667661 john ============================================================= The just shall live by Faith... Der Gerechte wird aus Glauben leben... Mas El Justo vivira Por Fe... Le Juste vivra par la foi... Habakkuk 2:4b, Romans 1:17, Galations 3:11, Hebrews 10:38 ============================================================= Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1 There is no other name... Acts 4:12 ============================================================= john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com http://www.helpmewithbiblestudy.org/ http://www.freegift.net/ - can you pass this test? http://www.wagoneers.com/BIBLE what about Islam? see: http://www.persecution.com/news/index.cfm?action=article&NewsId=111 ============================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 00:15:31 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build A: If you want to get back some of that bottom end, advance the timing chain set 3-5 degrees. (10 would be too much) You move the whole power band down with it, so you lose some top end. I'm dialing in the cam for my stroker this way. My oldest son is clearing space to get Black Jack inside my garage so we can work on it anytime night or day. (It's a tight squeeze in a 10' wide space though!) From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build Basically, I put a lot of Edelbrock parts on mine. In retrospect.....I think I lost some of the low end torque. However, it really has lots more power now at higher RPM's (3 grand and above). I have no problems on the highway and daily driving is fine. Started out with a rebuilt, rebored motor. Parts I used were Edelbrock chain and sprockets, cam, lifters, springs, retainers, 1400 carb, EGR manifold, valve covers and air cleaner. The last two of course were entirely for looks! Painted it AMC blue for effect. Oh yeah, don't forget to get the Edelbrock linkage extension part for your throttle linkage. Plus, I have a problem with my cruise control chain hitting the 15 inch air cleaner on the bottom. I'd probably go with a 14 inch or smaller air cleaner at this point but you know, the 15 inch with my new K&N air filter really breaths well! I can send a picture if you want. Probably have about $2,000 wrapped up in engine and parts and another $500 to $1,000 in miscellaneous parts like hoses, pumps, new 4 core radiator (bored motor runs hot), etc. PS: I have a full set of lifters, springs, retainers, and cam for a stock 360. Also have some extra parts - my original '81 engine with manifold and carb. Some '79 engine parts from a J20 - intake and exhaust manifolds and a carb (2 barrel). Also have my original '81 engine with carb and intake manifold. - - --Vince '81 Wagoneer ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 07:00:51 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: Tornado talkin' From: john < john-at-wagoneers.com > Subject: fsj: modified-schmodified... Personally I think RJ is trying to make things too granular. We'll soon have groups for discussions on lugnuts, oil filler tubes, dipstick openings, shift levers, steering wheel adjustments, rear window problems and so on... :) ======= Where do I sign up for the rear window problem list? :) Only a little bit more seriously, R.J. and I took pictures of an M725 in Silverton, very well preserved, and I fell in love with the Tornado 6 cyl. If anyone knows of a pickup that's not too rusted out, with the Tornado in it, I am interested. Thanks, Landon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 20:16:34 -0600 From: Gary Clark Subject: fsj: birds? That would be a common scavanger, the Magpie. A nice looking bird, that feeds on anything. Gary > > Speaking of birds, we saw a blackbird with white wing stripes in Ouray. Anyone > know what it was? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 21:41:15 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build Thanks Jim! I was wondering if that would be the thing to do! One tooth of the sprocket would probably make all the difference on the low end. But I think I'll wait for now. Too much trouble to adjust it and I'd mess up my new engine paint! - --Vince - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim B" To: "local Jeep list" Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 2:15 AM Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build > A: If you want to get back some of that bottom end, advance the timing chain > set 3-5 degrees. (10 would be too much) You move the whole power band down > with it, so you lose some top end. I'm dialing in the cam for my stroker this > way. My oldest son is clearing space to get Black Jack inside my garage so we > can work on it anytime night or day. (It's a tight squeeze in a 10' wide space > though!) > From: "Vince Orr" > Subject: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build > > Basically, I put a lot of Edelbrock parts on mine. In retrospect.....I > think I lost some of the low end torque. However, it really has lots more > power now at higher RPM's (3 grand and above). I have no problems on the > highway and daily driving is fine. > Started out with a rebuilt, rebored motor. Parts I used were Edelbrock > chain and sprockets, cam, lifters, springs, retainers, 1400 carb, EGR > manifold, valve covers and air cleaner. The last two of course were > entirely for looks! Painted it AMC blue for effect. > Oh yeah, don't forget to get the Edelbrock linkage extension part for your > throttle linkage. Plus, I have a problem with my cruise control chain > hitting the 15 inch air cleaner on the bottom. I'd probably go with a 14 > inch or smaller air cleaner at this point but you know, the 15 inch with my > new K&N air filter really breaths well! > I can send a picture if you want. Probably have about $2,000 wrapped up in > engine and parts and another $500 to $1,000 in miscellaneous parts like > hoses, pumps, new 4 core radiator (bored motor runs hot), etc. > > PS: I have a full set of lifters, springs, retainers, and cam for a stock > 360. Also have some extra parts - my original '81 engine with manifold and > carb. Some '79 engine parts from a J20 - intake and exhaust manifolds and a > carb (2 barrel). Also have my original '81 engine with carb and intake > manifold. > - --Vince > '81 Wagoneer ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 06:10:06 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build JIM: Oh man! I would have screwed that up royally! Good thing I follow directions like a good little robot! If I had the luxury of a machine shop, you know what I wanted to do? Crane roller rockers. However, I found out later that I would have had to have the rocker posts on the heads milled down slightly and retapped. Plus, you introduce new valve lash adjustments and such with that deal.....Stock rockers are torqued on and you're done....Scrapped the idea when I started running out of money :( .....would have rather had a suspension lift anyway. Found a place in Geneva, IL the other day. It's called "Lou's Sales and Service". Used to be a Jeep dealer (since 1946) but sold the dealership and now the owner deals in used Jeeps and service. Has a nice collection of very nice used Jeeps of all sizes. Has several FSJ's. Some parts vehicles sitting out back. Pickups, cherokees, and wagoneers. He carries parts that most Jeep dealers don't have on hand, if at all. Anyone let me know if you need contact information. We need to take care of this guy! Non FSJ content: Had to take the TJ in for service yesterday. It is a 1999 model and so far, both pinion seals have leaked, needed dash work 'cause defroster didn't work, and the latest, my cable on the instrument cluster was broken and had to be replaced. Even with warranty help, it cost me $160 to fix this crap at the dealer.....what a ripoff. Saw the new H2 hummer - and like that wierd kid on the Simpsons....all I can say is.....Ha Ha... No disrespect intended but Hummers don't impress me much. Sort of the way Caddie, Lincoln, and many of the import SUV's don't impress me. BTW: I opted for the new rifle over the suspension lift. :) Rez wants to go hunting NOW....and my stock suspension can handle anything in the midwest that I want to take on....(key point...avoid deep mud...."deep" is defined as greater than 14" average....anything else, I got no real business in there anyway!) - --Vince '81 wagoneer (Rez Runner) '99 TJ (hasn't earned a name, perhaps "rock catcher" fits - big rock chip in my windshield now...) ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim B To: Vince Orr Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 1:11 AM Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build not 1 tooth! That would be about 15 degrees! Way too much! We notch the cam keyway on a different angle at a machine shop. ----- Original Message ----- From: Vince Orr Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 7:41 PM To: Jim B; FSJ List Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build Thanks Jim! I was wondering if that would be the thing to do! One tooth of the sprocket would probably make all the difference on the low end. But I think I'll wait for now. Too much trouble to adjust it and I'd mess up my new engine paint! --Vince ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim B" To: "local Jeep list" Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 2:15 AM Subject: Re: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build > A: If you want to get back some of that bottom end, advance the timing chain > set 3-5 degrees. (10 would be too much) You move the whole power band down > with it, so you lose some top end. I'm dialing in the cam for my stroker this > way. My oldest son is clearing space to get Black Jack inside my garage so we > can work on it anytime night or day. (It's a tight squeeze in a 10' wide space > though!) > From: "Vince Orr" > Subject: fsj: Re: AMC 360 build > > Basically, I put a lot of Edelbrock parts on mine. In retrospect.....I > think I lost some of the low end torque. However, it really has lots more > power now at higher RPM's (3 grand and above). I have no problems on the > highway and daily driving is fine. > Started out with a rebuilt, rebored motor. Parts I used were Edelbrock > chain and sprockets, cam, lifters, springs, retainers, 1400 carb, EGR > manifold, valve covers and air cleaner. The last two of course were > entirely for looks! Painted it AMC blue for effect. > Oh yeah, don't forget to get the Edelbrock linkage extension part for your > throttle linkage. Plus, I have a problem with my cruise control chain > hitting the 15 inch air cleaner on the bottom. I'd probably go with a 14 > inch or smaller air cleaner at this point but you know, the 15 inch with my > new K&N air filter really breaths well! > I can send a picture if you want. Probably have about $2,000 wrapped up in > engine and parts and another $500 to $1,000 in miscellaneous parts like > hoses, pumps, new 4 core radiator (bored motor runs hot), etc. > > PS: I have a full set of lifters, springs, retainers, and cam for a stock > 360. Also have some extra parts - my original '81 engine with manifold and > carb. Some '79 engine parts from a J20 - intake and exhaust manifolds and a > carb (2 barrel). Also have my original '81 engine with carb and intake > manifold. > - --Vince > '81 Wagoneer ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1739 **************************