From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Oct 21 16:36:04 2002 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Monday, October 21 2002 Volume 01 : Number 1774 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: new powerplant for hondas... :) Re: fsj: Re: boat anchors Re: fsj: Re: JEEP INFO fsj: bushing in... fsj: Parts for 1979 J10 pickup? fsj: Re: new powerplant for hondas... :) fsj: Re: Lock Rights fsj: Correct Distributor Vacuum fsj: Correct Distributor Vacuum Re: fsj: Re: new powerplant for hondas... :) Re: fsj: Parts for 1979 J10 pickup? Re: fsj: Might have to sell the Waggy fsj: It Needs A New Home fsj: Re: question FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 11:59:01 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: new powerplant for hondas... :) http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/Civic_V-1.jpg someone found the Rocket Car story on my server and sent me this picture... :) john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:39:53 -0700 From: "Mike BALL" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: boat anchors A quick internet search,with one more quick search for a second opinion,gave me these engine weights: Small block Chevy V8-575 LBS. AMC V8- 540 LBS. Jag V12 680 lBS. If these are off,someone let me know,but I'll take the AMC engine over the other two any day,despite it's poorly designed oiling system(easily corrected with the oiling kits on the market). The small block Chevy is obviously an amazingly successfull engine design,and quite powerfull as well-I've driven quite a few over the years(but only owned one-it was free!). But even if that SBC displaced an equal 400ci, it's no match in the power department to the 401's I've driven with similar compression,emissions,etc. The 401 will easily say "bye-bye" to that SBC in acceleration,especially off-the line. You want to talk "Boat Anchors"-now that's the Jag V12. I've driven a few of those as well,and in town they accelerated like a sled. Granted, these were heavily emmissioned(and heavy)XJ12's,but I have no doubt a smogger SBC or AMC would've mopped the floor with it 0-60,not to mention in gas mileage and maintenance costs. The V12 requires a second mortage to tune-up,and it's fuel mileage make's the AMC V8 look like an economy engine,although,of course, the Chevy would be the champ here in MPG. That being said,the V12 is very smooth and long-legged. I borrowed my dad's XJ12 for a while when I was regularly commuting about 130 miles round trip dating my girlfriend(now wife) on weekends. On the quieter portions of the 210 FWY towards Pasadena(L.A) I was often amazed to look down and see I was doing 100MPH... I thought- I surely CAN'T be doing 100MPH...Felt like maybe 65 at the most... Mike Ball 89GW 360(401 soon)/727/229/D44's/ARB's/4.09's/SkyJacker System/33" MTR's Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 11:02:07 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: boat anchors... A: He won't be dragging his oil pan. The old motor was the V12! A 401 is a few more cubes than the 372 V12, but slightly lighter IIRC (I could be wrong!) I gave him my home number so he could call me when it's done or if he needs a hand with some logistics of bolting things in. From: john Subject: fsj: Re: boat anchors... At 07:41 AM 10/18/2002 +0000, fsj-digest wrote: >Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 00:39:57 -0700 >From: "Jim B" >Subject: fsj: and now for something completely different >I stumbled onto an idea when I yes, I'd say "stumbled" is the right word... ;) rofl... while there may be few substitutes for cubes I doubt I'd recommend dropping something as heavy, inefficient and dowdy as an AMC engine in something like a Jag... he'll probably be dragging the oil pan on the ground... and the thing will understeer like a front loader with a yard of gravel and bald tires on wet pavement... >had a customer come in with a Jag XJ12 with a tossed rod (it still ran, and >he was trying to figure out why it was missing and leaking oil, although >surprisingly not too bad!) When I pointed it out to him the reason for his >English Lead'r he was trying to figure out what to replace it with (they're >a little hard to come by at a reasonable cost here) I looked and saw he had >the uni-pattern GM TH400, cool, he could have put a GM Diesel in there... instead... ;) > so my suggestion was for him to call my local Jeep >wrecking yard for an early AMC motor. He found one alright! He got a 401 >with the TH400 (someone put a unipattern behind it in a '73) and will now be >pumping up his sick kitty! He scored the whole rig for parts for $250! >(Everyone else was trying to get him to go with a bowtide, as in boat >anchor) I'd suggest changing store locations so when he comes looking for you he'll have a harder time... ;) rofl... john ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 14:20:19 -0700 From: "Mike BALL" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: JEEP INFO Actually, I've seen a few people over the years running front locking hubs with a NP229 T-case. I've run them for years with no problems. But- one MUST use his noggin with this combo. Yes,if you forget to lock your hubs,and put it in 4HI and drive-just say "goodbye" to your viscous coupler. Not to mention if you parked it on a hill in 4hi with the hubs unlocked-if you just put it in park-with no e-brake on. Then, just like if you had parked a NP228 equipped FSJ with unlocked front hubs in 4hi with no e-brake on-wave "bye-bye" as your wag rolls away from you down the street. I wouldn't recommend this set-up to those who have other people driving their Wag too. The reason I ditched my front drive hubs and went with Warn Premiums is not for the zillionth of a mile of MPG I'd pick up,nor the slightly decreased front axle parts wear,but the easy ability to disconnect ALL the front axle parts if I break something in the front end off-roading-so I can get back home or at least get off the trail if I don't have repair parts. I also carry an original solid front drive hub with me in case I grenade a hub.... Mike Ball 89GW Original message... .... just do NOT put hubs on the front of that thing... make sure you use only ATF in the xfr case... either violations will result in the destruction of the viscous coupler (nP229). ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 17:44:06 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: bushing in... Got the bushing in the crank, started the bolts for the flexplate, torque spec says 105 ft lbs... son is out rattle canning his '62 Galaxy and I'm doing a little work on my '87 xj... heading down to Renton to meet Red Green, hopefully won't be crowded.... or late. :) thanx Glenn, Paul, Curtis and Jim for the bushing, the flex plate bolts, advice and for bringing the subject up. The bushing fit over the tc perfectly and fit in the crank the same... have pictures, might post later. later, john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/Filter_INFORMATION/air_filter-1.jpg http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/Filter_INFORMATION/air_filter-2.jpg SJ Jeeps: 360/401: TS-23 258: TS-12 retail $21.50 XJ Jeeps: 4.0L/2.5L('87 and up): TS-29 retail $29.95 WJ Jeeps: 4.7L: TS-104 retail $47.50 DieselBenz: typical S1118 or S1680 retail $32.50 or $39.85 http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ order 1-800-956-5695 cust# 283461 Snohomish, WA, where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 23:50:55 EDT From: Shmohney-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Parts for 1979 J10 pickup? Anybody know where I can still buy new parts such as turn signal light lenses, rearview mirrors, heating/cooling vent louvres, gearshift knob, dashboard face, chrome grill, etc. for a 1979 J10 Pickup? All that plastic stuff is deteriorating, and cannibalizing from other trucks (on the rare occasions when they can be found) isn't much use as they seem to be in the same condition. Thanks! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 21:39:34 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: new powerplant for hondas... :) At 07:54 PM 10/20/2002 -0700, Mike - G wrote: >Yeah, I thought that was a darwin award story ? yeah it was... but the guy that claims to really have done it wrote a story about it... a friend of mine claims to have been in the navy with him and says it's true... the story is here: http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/ >---- >mike-g-at-mike-g.net . http://www.mike-g.net/ >KG6MDD >boom.boom.beep.beep >5-6" lift, 32" tires, 4.56's, gears, >----- Original Message ----- >From: john >To: >Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2002 11:59 AM >Subject: fsj: new powerplant for hondas... :) > > > > http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/Civic_V-1.jpg > > > > someone found the Rocket Car story on my server and sent me this > > picture... :) > > > > john > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 21:56:55 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Lock Rights At 08:49 AM 10/20/2002 +0000, FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com wrote: > > Anybody have any experience with a Lock Right Locker? my son has one in the rear of his '77 Cherokee... that's the lunchbox unit, right? PowerTrax Lock Right, or am I confused? Anyway, we got his shock tower fixed and I finally drove it and found the Locker to be as annoying as the Detroit. When I accelerated it moved one way or t'other and I couldn't tell which. same when I backed off the gas... It many not have been as bad as a locker in an XJ overall, but it was still unpleasant... john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:19:50 -0400 From: "Frazier Phillips" Subject: fsj: Correct Distributor Vacuum On my 86 GW, my idle vacuum at the distributor, when engine is hot is 10.5 in. Hg (26.5 cm Hg). This appears too high. Where do I start to look to correct this? I believe this high vacuum causes the engine to ping when accelerating lightly. Heavy acceleration causes no pinging. Thanks, Frazier [demime 0.99c.7 removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:32:44 -0400 From: "Frazier Phillips" Subject: fsj: Correct Distributor Vacuum On my 86 GW, my idle vacuum at the distributor, when engine is hot is 10.5 in. Hg (26.5 cm Hg). This appears too high. Where do I start to look to correct this? I believe this high vacuum causes the engine to ping when accelerating lightly. Heavy acceleration causes no pinging. Thanks, Frazier ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:20:13 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Re: new powerplant for hondas... :) john said: {- > > http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/Civic_V-1.jpg {- > > {- > > someone found the Rocket Car story on my server and sent me this {- > > picture... :) {- > > {- At 07:54 PM 10/20/2002 -0700, Mike - G wrote: {- >Yeah, I thought that was a darwin award story ? {- {- yeah it was... but the guy that claims to really {- have done it wrote a story about it... a friend {- of mine claims to have been in the navy with him {- and says it's true... {- {- the story is here: {- http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/ Umm, correct me if I'm wrong, but that Civic picture looks like a "buzz bomb". Don't know where they got it -- most likely it's just a mock-up - -- but I seriously doubt it has anything in it. If it had any amount of fuel in it, that Civic would be sagging worse than that car in the pics from a lumberyard (where a guy on drugs insisted they strap a couple dozen sheets of thick plywood to the top of his car), and the roof would probably cave in even with the little reinforcement pieces they put up there. And that doesn't look like any kind of rocket thrust in the last pic; it looks like a sparkler and a smoke bomb. JATOs look like serious rocket engines when they're fired, because, well, that's what they are. The pics in http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/JatoDodge-MotorTrend-May57.jpg do look like a real JATO as far as I can tell, though I'm no expert. Note in the first pic, the plume of smoke (or whatever) coming out the back. You can tell the speed of the car somewhat from how long the plume is; note the plume is still fairly tight many carlengths back; it hasn't spread out. Anybody who has driven on gravel roads a lot can see the difference in a second. Also note that in the last picture, you can see a little bit of road dust from the tires; I'm guessing the car was just starting out or just finished in that pic. You can't even see any road dust from the tires from the distance the first pic was taken. Last, note they're putting in "only" one JATO bottle. The urban legend sounds like a much larger one strapped on the top of the car. The way they really did it in that article makes a lot more sense. And note they still "only" got up to 140mph. No slamming into a cliff at 300mph+. I'm _guessing_ those JATO bottles are about the size of the ones they use on some C130s to make their take-off faster -- but those use two banks of probably a half-dozen JATO bottles. (Very impressive watching the angle those take off at... They lean back to about 45 degrees and then just shoot upward at about the same angle.) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are sure you understand everything that is going on, you are hopelessly confused. -- Walter Mondale - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:21:25 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Parts for 1979 J10 pickup? Shmohney-at-aol.com said: {- Anybody know where I can still buy new parts such as turn signal light {- lenses, rearview mirrors, heating/cooling vent louvres, gearshift knob, {- dashboard face, chrome grill, etc. for a 1979 J10 Pickup? All that plastic {- stuff is deteriorating, and cannibalizing from other trucks (on the rare {- occasions when they can be found) isn't much use as they seem to be in the {- same condition. Thanks! Try eBay. Especially for the various lights and lenses. You might just have to keep watching for awhile; you can also save your searches on eBay and have it email you when there's something new that meets the search criteria. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tell me if you win would it show In a thousand years who would know As a million lives come and go On this same piece of ground -- Savatage - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:14:30 -0600 From: "Daniel Beiers" Subject: Re: fsj: Might have to sell the Waggy Sorry! I am in Denver. As for how much, I don't know. I was going to see what kind of offers I got. I paid 3500 for it about 18 months ago. It's in very nice condition and I thought it was an amazing deal when I bought it. Since then the little rust spot in the rear quarter panel has grown some. Conversely, I have fixed all of the little things that were not working etc. I was thinking around 2700. I have some pictures if anyone is interested. They are not wonderful, scans of photos, but they might help give a better idea. Its garnet by the way. Thanks Jim Dan > Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 01:06:58 -0700 > From: "Jim B" > Subject: Re: fsj: Might have to sell the Waggy > > A: The usual questions: Where and how much? (not for me. I can only get > something else if I sell my Comanche, and I already have another project > waiting for completion!) > From: "Daniel Beiers" > Subject: fsj: Might have to sell the Waggy > > Guys, > I just found a great deal on a new(er) Jeep (Grand Cherokee). If I can > work the financing out I am going to go for it. Unfortunatley I will need > every penny I can get, and I think the wagoneer has to go...just when I > fiqured out the charging issues :( > > Here are the specs. It will officially be on the market when I hear from my > bank. > > 1985 Grand Wagoneer > 125,800 miles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 10:30:44 -0400 From: "B. C." Subject: fsj: It Needs A New Home Greetings To The FSJ World! A young man here in beautiful Dayton, Ohio has approached me to assist in finding a new home for his Chero. So here are the vitals: - - 79 Cherokee S - - 2 door - - 360 - Auto Tranny - 4 x 4 - - Engine did run, prior to failure of underhood wiring. - - May have factory bull bar on front - - At some point in its life it has been repainted a funky green color, both inside, & outside. - - good tires, and wheels - - rough interior - - bad floor pan - - no radio - - $500 or best offer - - It must find a new home quickly!!! - - Call: 937-279-1902 with all of your questions Until The Next Dimension, Admiral "Coluch." Starfleet Headquarters Ohio Post END TRANSMISSION.................................... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 14:42:53 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: question interesting pictures... pretty straight, but man is that paint shot. :) Anyway, prime the carb. Pour some gas down the intake while starting it... it's quite possible there just isn't fuel in the line, hopefully by getting the engine to run it'll be able to pump enough to get it back in the system. I doubt your fuel pump was bad. You'll need to change the filter too. You could rig up a small gravity feed fuel system directly to the fuel filter, maybe a milk jug suspended by a hook under the hood with a line going to the filter input. Leave the input to the filter going into another can or bucket so when goes does start pumping you don't have it spraying all over the place. Be very careful of fire. Playing with gas like this could get interesting in a hurry. Have a fire extinguisher handy, but DON'T use it if you can help it as it'll make a terrible mess. Have some clean dry rags to snuff out any small fires. If you get flames out of the carb keep cranking, it'll draw it down into the engine... Good luck, and $300 will be a great price... lots of work ahead of you though... replace all those vacuum lines, ignition wires and make sure all the wiring is tied up and protected unless you want a rolling bbq pit. :) later, john At 02:57 PM 10/21/2002 -0500, John Pettit wrote: >John, > >I was wondering if you could answer a question for me? I ran across a >1979 Wagoneer and it has been sitting for 2 years. The guy said that he >started it about 6 months ago and the fuel pump was pumping gas......but I >tried to start it and there wasn't any fuel coming out anywhere. I put >about 4 gallons of gas in it, and then I put a new fuel pump in >it. Still, the same thing - no gas anywhere. Then, I tried blowing >through the gas line - and I could hear the air coming out through the >other end - so I don't think that the lines are clogged, but I'm not >sure. I would love to get this wagon running - and the guy is going to >sell it to me for about $300 if I want it. But, if I can't get it >running, then I don't need to waste money...also - I'm sending a picture >of it too - just in case you were curious. > >Thanks!! > >john > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1774 **************************