From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Oct 23 10:28:27 2007 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, October 23 2007 Volume 01 : Number 2940 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Wagoneer parts fsj: ATF Re: fsj: ATF Re: fsj: ATF fsj: RE: ATF fsj: RE: ATF RE: fsj: RE: ATF RE: fsj: ATF Re: fsj: ATF RE: fsj: RE: ATF RE: fsj: ATF Re: fsj: ATF Re: fsj: RE: ATF Re: fsj: Wagoneer parts RE: fsj: ATF RE: fsj: RE: ATF RE: fsj: ATF FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:27:44 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: fsj: Wagoneer parts My brother-in-law sent this: http://desmoines.craigslist.org/pts/448167069.html The last item is factory sunroof. John. ;) I don't know this person; reportedly in Cedar Rapids, IA. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dain bramaged. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:48:37 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: fsj: ATF Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or anything. The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt right after I bought it, probably around 2000. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You left just when you were becoming interesting. -- Henry Jones - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:02:29 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: ATF ----the best thing to use in all is the amsoil synthetic atf... go to amsoil's site from the link on wagoneers.com, customer #283461 - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Dan Black wrote: # Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I # can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what # the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) # # One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or # anything. # # The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt # right after I bought it, probably around 2000. # # ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # You left just when you were becoming interesting. # # -- Henry Jones # -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:58:19 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: ATF john said: {- ----the best thing to use in all is {- the amsoil synthetic atf... go to {- amsoil's site from the link on wagoneers.com, {- customer #283461 (a) Doesn't help when I need something on short notice. Note that I DID say: # (And I mean stuff that I # can find in a standard department store or auto place today (b) I don't want to mix synthetic with non-. And I'm not inclined to drain it and replace it at the moment. (c) I'm also not inclined to put more expensive stuff I have to order in when it's probably leaking. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Cattle mutilations are up. -- Mother - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:21:48 -0700 From: "Tesar Landon-r16884" Subject: fsj: RE: ATF Believe it is the ATF+3 version...Autozone has a surprisingly good selection... I read the manual said it is ok to top off with Dexron/Mercon.... It helped that I replaced the Dexron/Mercon III w/ ATF+3....when I had a Jeep...sniff. - - Landon - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Dan Black Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 8:49 AM To: Full Size Jeeps Subject: fsj: ATF Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or anything. The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt right after I bought it, probably around 2000. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - ------- You left just when you were becoming interesting. -- Henry Jones - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org - -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:22:42 -0700 From: "Tesar Landon-r16884" Subject: fsj: RE: ATF Ooh, that is for the TF727.... Dexron/Mercon for the TH400 - -----Original Message----- From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 10:22 AM To: 'Dan Black'; Full Size Jeeps Subject: RE: ATF Believe it is the ATF+3 version...Autozone has a surprisingly good selection... I read the manual said it is ok to top off with Dexron/Mercon.... It helped that I replaced the Dexron/Mercon III w/ ATF+3....when I had a Jeep...sniff. - - Landon - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Dan Black Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 8:49 AM To: Full Size Jeeps Subject: fsj: ATF Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or anything. The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt right after I bought it, probably around 2000. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - ------- You left just when you were becoming interesting. -- Henry Jones - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org - -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:29:59 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: RE: ATF Dexron2/Mercon became Dexron3/Mercon (they added stuff to help the lockup converters). Mopar ATF+4 should NOT be used in 3 speed autos like the 727. Ford Mercon V and Mercon V+ are straight synthetic fluids. More expensive than necessary for 727s (probably more than triple the price of regular fluid with no real benefit to 3 speed autos) Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will like them only Entangle and hold the poor and weak, while the rich and powerful will easily break through them ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) > Subject: fsj: RE: ATF > Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:22:42 -0700 > From: landon.tesar-at-freescale.com > To: landon.tesar-at-freescale.com; dan-at-black.org; fsj-at-digest.net > > Ooh, that is for the TF727.... > > Dexron/Mercon for the TH400 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tesar Landon-r16884 > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 10:22 AM > To: 'Dan Black'; Full Size Jeeps > Subject: RE: ATF > > Believe it is the ATF+3 version...Autozone has a surprisingly good > selection... > I read the manual said it is ok to top off with Dexron/Mercon.... > > It helped that I replaced the Dexron/Mercon III w/ ATF+3....when I had a > Jeep...sniff. > > - Landon > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of > Dan Black > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 8:49 AM > To: Full Size Jeeps > Subject: fsj: ATF > > Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I > can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what > the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) > > One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or > anything. > > The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt > right after I bought it, probably around 2000. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ------- > You left just when you were becoming interesting. > > -- Henry Jones > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org > -------------- _________________________________________________________________ Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Cafi. Stop by today. http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLt agline ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:32:30 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: ATF If someone needs Amsoil near here (Lynnwood, WA) my local NAPA in Thrasher's Corner also sells it. (my store doesn't because it's corporate owned) Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will like them only Entangle and hold the poor and weak, while the rich and powerful will easily break through them ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) > To: fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: fsj: ATF > From: dan-at-black.org > Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:58:19 -0500 > > john said: > {- ----the best thing to use in all is > {- the amsoil synthetic atf... go to > {- amsoil's site from the link on wagoneers.com, > {- customer #283461 > > (a) Doesn't help when I need something on short notice. > Note that I DID say: > # (And I mean stuff that I > # can find in a standard department store or auto place today > > (b) I don't want to mix synthetic with non-. And I'm not inclined to > drain it and replace it at the moment. > > (c) I'm also not inclined to put more expensive stuff I have to order in > when it's probably leaking. > > - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- > Cattle mutilations are up. > -- Mother > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org - -------------- _________________________________________________________________ Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne ws ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:49:42 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: ATF the 100% synthetic ATF is what you want to use... I do... http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Dan Black wrote: # Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I # can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what # the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) # # One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or # anything. # # The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt # right after I bought it, probably around 2000. # # ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # You left just when you were becoming interesting. # # -- Henry Jones # -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:52:25 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: RE: ATF the amsoil synthetic atf is universal and helps to reduce temperatures, very critical in the 727s http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # Dexron2/Mercon became Dexron3/Mercon (they added stuff to help the lockup # converters). Mopar ATF+4 should NOT be used in 3 speed autos like the 727. # Ford Mercon V and Mercon V+ are straight synthetic fluids. More expensive than # necessary for 727s (probably more than triple the price of regular fluid with # no real benefit to 3 speed autos) # # Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will # # like them only Entangle and # hold the poor and # # weak, while the rich and powerful will easily # # break # through them # # # # ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) # # > Subject: fsj: RE: ATF # > Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:22:42 -0700 # > From: landon.tesar-at-freescale.com # > To: landon.tesar-at-freescale.com; dan-at-black.org; fsj-at-digest.net # > # > Ooh, that is for the TF727.... # > # > Dexron/Mercon for the TH400 # > # > -----Original Message----- # > From: Tesar Landon-r16884 # > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 10:22 AM # > To: 'Dan Black'; Full Size Jeeps # > Subject: RE: ATF # > # > Believe it is the ATF+3 version...Autozone has a surprisingly good # > selection... # > I read the manual said it is ok to top off with Dexron/Mercon.... # > # > It helped that I replaced the Dexron/Mercon III w/ ATF+3....when I had a # > Jeep...sniff. # > # > - Landon # > # > -----Original Message----- # > From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # > Dan Black # > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 8:49 AM # > To: Full Size Jeeps # > Subject: fsj: ATF # > # > Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I # > can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what # > the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) # > # > One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or # > anything. # > # > The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt # > right after I bought it, probably around 2000. # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > ------- # > You left just when you were becoming interesting. # > # > -- Henry Jones # > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org # > -------------- # # _________________________________________________________________ # Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Cafi. Stop by # today. # http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLt # agline # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:53:11 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: ATF support your local FSJ web server: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ we are all independent dealers... buying it there won't support your addiction jim. ;) (or mine. ;) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # If someone needs Amsoil near here (Lynnwood, WA) my local NAPA in Thrasher's # Corner also sells it. (my store doesn't because it's corporate owned) # # Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will # # like them only Entangle and # hold the poor and # # weak, while the rich and powerful will easily # # break # through them # # # # ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) # # > To: fsj-at-digest.net # > Subject: Re: fsj: ATF # > From: dan-at-black.org # > Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:58:19 -0500 # > # > john said: # > {- ----the best thing to use in all is # > {- the amsoil synthetic atf... go to # > {- amsoil's site from the link on wagoneers.com, # > {- customer #283461 # > # > (a) Doesn't help when I need something on short notice. # > Note that I DID say: # > # (And I mean stuff that I # > # can find in a standard department store or auto place today # > # > (b) I don't want to mix synthetic with non-. And I'm not inclined to # > drain it and replace it at the moment. # > # > (c) I'm also not inclined to put more expensive stuff I have to order in # > when it's probably leaking. # > # > # ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- # -- # > Cattle mutilations are up. # > -- Mother # > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org # -------------- # # _________________________________________________________________ # Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! # http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne # ws # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:54:40 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: ATF they'll ship UPS ASAP... direct to you... mixing amsoil with regular atf is NOT a problem. understand about the leaks... ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Dan Black wrote: # john said: # {- ----the best thing to use in all is # {- the amsoil synthetic atf... go to # {- amsoil's site from the link on wagoneers.com, # {- customer #283461 # # (a) Doesn't help when I need something on short notice. # Note that I DID say: # # (And I mean stuff that I # # can find in a standard department store or auto place today # # (b) I don't want to mix synthetic with non-. And I'm not inclined to # drain it and replace it at the moment. # # (c) I'm also not inclined to put more expensive stuff I have to order in # when it's probably leaking. # # ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # Cattle mutilations are up. # -- Mother # -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:56:23 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: RE: ATF be very, very careful about which ATF to put into a 727! the wrong stuff will damage it... curtis destroyed rocky's 727 by having the wrong stuff put in... double check with a qualified trans shop, NOT a parts house... ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Tesar Landon-r16884 wrote: # Believe it is the ATF+3 version...Autozone has a surprisingly good # selection... # I read the manual said it is ok to top off with Dexron/Mercon.... # # It helped that I replaced the Dexron/Mercon III w/ ATF+3....when I had a # Jeep...sniff. # # - Landon # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # Dan Black # Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 8:49 AM # To: Full Size Jeeps # Subject: fsj: ATF # # Hey, what ATF should I be using for my FSJs? (And I mean stuff that I # can find in a standard department store or auto place today, not what # the factory manual says that you can't find anymore.) # # One's an '88 Grand Wagoneer, which has a TF727, never rebuilt or # anything. # # The other is the '74 Wagoneer, which has a TH400, which was rebuilt # right after I bought it, probably around 2000. # # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # ------- # You left just when you were becoming interesting. # # -- Henry Jones # -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org # -------------- # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:58:03 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Wagoneer parts cool... you can buy these new, installed, with the updated headliners for about $1600. :) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Dan Black wrote: # My brother-in-law sent this: # http://desmoines.craigslist.org/pts/448167069.html # # The last item is factory sunroof. John. ;) # # I don't know this person; reportedly in Cedar Rapids, IA. # # ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # Dain bramaged. # -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:43:32 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: ATF I meant to say if you weren't home. Didn't know about the drop ship deal. support your local FSJ web server: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ we are all independent dealers... buying it there won't support your addiction jim. ;) (or mine. ;) _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook ^V together at last. Get it now. http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971 033 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:46:41 +0000 From: michel balea Subject: RE: fsj: RE: ATF > Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:56:23 -0700 > From: john > Subject: Re: fsj: RE: ATF > > be very, very careful about which ATF to put into > a 727! the wrong stuff will damage it... curtis > destroyed rocky's 727 by having the wrong stuff put in... > > double check with a qualified trans shop, NOT a parts house so what is the wrong stuff? As for qualified trans shop.... Jim will telll us that Aamco is not a qualified shop! I used the dextron/mercron II or III on both the TH400 (did Moab and back this year after i did the service) 334,xxx miles on OEM tranny. And the TF727 a few years ago (4 years already).... i used a whole case of the same dextron/mercron..... when i purchased the $250 1985 Gwagoneer for lab and practice runs.... the fluid was so loaded w little metal flakes, I was sure the 727 would not hold up.... i rinsed it (disconnecting one trany cooler hose) and ran about 8 quarts until it was bright red on the output. Did a few HD towing (another wagoneer from the bay area to the sierras foothill.... yes some climbing.... but it was february, so not too hot... but it kept my feet warm... stopped a few times on the steep climb to let it cool a bit.... and also to let people pass me.... It was a weekday so not too much to worry about... in fact it started to snow at some point.... and that engine was still running warm..... The 85 is still running fine.... except for a mega exhaust leak.... No motivation to dig into the work... until i have all my plans aligned.... I know that 2 bolt are seized.... cheers Michel 74 wagoneer P.S: hope the san diego area people are OK...... my daughter called.... and it is a major catastrophy.... all schools, and colleges and universities are closed.... tried to convinced her to fly back.... Not the best place for your lungs.... M _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook ^V together at last. Get it now. http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971 033 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 10:27:56 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: ATF yeah, it's so much easier now... you can call or go via the web and I get the sale... not much involved, but it's something. :) before I'd have to order it, wait for shipment, then get it to you. now you can call, use customer 283461, they'll ship it to your door, from the warehouse in portland, so it's only a day or two! warehouses all over the states... john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # I meant to say if you weren't home. Didn't know about the drop ship deal. # # # support your local FSJ web server: # # http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ # # we are all independent dealers... buying it there won't # support your addiction jim. ;) (or mine. ;) # _________________________________________________________________ # Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook - together at last. Get it now. # http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971 033 ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2940 **************************