From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Thu Nov 15 15:28:12 2007 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Thursday, November 15 2007 Volume 01 : Number 2954 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility fsj: administrivia: notes on using this list RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility Re: xj: RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility Re: xj: Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:07:00 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility if you ever wonder why wagoneers.com is so fast, it's the datacenter... (well, and Linux and Apache, but it's the network that makes it work so well...) the digital forest in Seattle... a worldclass facility. it's one of the finest data centers I've ever been in... if you're looking for a colocation facility you need to check these guys out. ran across the video of them putting in additional HVAC during an upgrade, http://www.forest.net/support/ it's down near the bottom... cool stuff... (no pun intended). :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 07:15:01 +0000 From: Richard Welty Subject: fsj: administrivia: notes on using this list Digest.Net mailing list "Meta FAQ" These general notes on using Digest.Net mailing lists are posted on the 1st and 15th of each month. This file may be found on the web at http://www.digest.net/general-notes.txt [last revised 5/1/02; removed list of spam strings, as i'm not the only one filtering on them -- rpw] Additional information on Digest.Net's spam policies may be found at http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html and http://www.digest.net/blocked.html Table of Contents 1. Why don't my postings go through? 2. Why can't I unsubscribe? 3. How do I post to the list? 4. Where are the archives? 5. What other lists are on digest.net? 6. Is there a web subscription form? 7. Why not move the lists to someplace like (egroups, topica,...)? 8. How do I contact the server adminstrator in an emergency? 9. What is Krusty Motorsports, anyway? The Meta-FAQ 1. Why don't my postings go through? There are several things that may interfere with postings making it to the list. a) Are you a member? Some read the ftp archives rather than receiving the list in email. Persons who read the list via email are automatically members, but readers of the FTP archive are not, and need to contact me (rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com) and get your name added to the list of "permitted senders". b) has your email address changed? some of you have had changes in your email address. your old address still works, and is still on the list, but your From: line shows a new address. this can happen for various reasons; you may have changed jobs or ISPs, and left a forward in place, or your IT staff may have fiddled with the email system. you will need to unsubscribe your old email address and subscribe the new one. this may require my involvement, if you can't figure out a way to get your old address off the list using the conventional majordomo commands. you can use the majordomo "which" command to probe for old addresses. send a message to majordomo-at-digest.net with one or more which commands in the body, one per line. to check for potential addresses for Fred Flinstone, formerly of bedrock.org, the following commands can be sent: which flintstone which bedrock note that the matches above might return any of the following addresses, if they appear in the list (in other words, you can use vagueness and incompleteness in your recollection as a tool): Fred.Flinstone-at-bedrock.org fflinstone-at-wilma.bedrock.org flintstonef-at-bedrock.com c) do you have more than one email address? if so, only the subscribed addresses can post, unless you contact me (see 1.a) above for relevant information) d) are you using (intentionally or accidentially) special "features" of your mail client? [this section is no longer operative, as the demime software now strips html, attachments, rich text format, etc. from postings automatically.] e) are your posts too large? there is a 10,000 character limit on posting sizes; this is done for various reasons. you can always split up large postings to get mail through. f) are you including majordomo commands at the start of your message? administrivia control is turned on; this is a trap for things like "unsubscribe" at the start of a message. try to avoid obvious majordomo commands in the subject and the first 10 lines, or misspell them in obvious ways (e.g. unzubscribe, 1ndex, h3lp, g3t, etc.) g) are you triggering spam traps? some things are red flags; for example, many phrases found commonly in spam are automatically blocked. h) are you using "funky" character sets? [7 bit restriction lifted experimentally on 8/2/00 -- film at 11] unfortunately, there are "issues" if i permit any character set other than old fashioned 7 level ASCII; therefore, you need to avoid national character sets that include various accents, umlauts, national currency characters such as the British pound symbol, etc. i) are you unintentionally including complete digests in your reply? You need to check and make sure you cut down replys to the minimal size; digests are between 20,000 and 25,000 characters in length, and if you include a complete digest in your reply, it clearly won't make the 10,000 character limit. By the way, this feature is intentional. j) Are you using a "bad" ISP or mail relay? See http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html for more information about Digest.Net policies about email. k) Is the error message you get back "User Unknown"? If so, you may be running afoul of spam control severices (again, see http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html) When these services register a hit, the error code 550 is returned. 550 is a generic code that many broken mail systems report as "user unknown". The "rejectlog" entries for the previous day's mail traffic on digest.net may be viewed at http://www.digest.net/rejectlog.01 Some of you may find it useful or instructive to use the telnet program to connect directly to port 25 on krusty-motorsports.com and see what kind of reply you get; this requires some technical knowledge and is not for everyone (you can get out of this at anytime after the initial banner simply by typing quit and hitting enter.) l) Is SMTP over TLS involved? This is a bit esoteric, but as of 8/8/01 the digest.net mail server will attempt to use "TLS" (Transport Layer Security) for outbound mail if the destination mail server offers it. SMTP over TLS is fairly new technology, and a bit buggy. I am monitoring the logs on the server, and when I see TLS related problems, I manually place the problem destinations on a special exception list; however, this may delay email to the destination host until I make the exception. 2. Why can't I unsubscribe? a) are you using the right address? send to majordomo-at-digest.net, and the command format is unsubscribe list-name my-email-address b) has your email address changed? majordomo has no way of knowing that Fred.Flinstone-at-BarneyCo.com was once fflintstone-at-bedrock.org. you can check this with the which command (see 1.b) above for details) 3. How do I post to the list? You may use either one of two addresses: for example, the bmw-digest may be reached using either bmw-at-digest.net or bmw-digest-at-digest.net If you are using the correct addresses and your posts don't show up, check out the stuff in 1. above. 4. Where are the archives? see ftp://ftp.digest.net/ for digest archives. the web archives have proven problematic, and are awaiting time for a systematic attack on the problems they've been having. 5. What other lists are on digest.net? see http://www.digest.net/ for more information. 6. Is there a web subscription form? Yes, recently added. go to http://www.digest.net/bin/digest-subs.cgi 7. Why not move the lists to someplace like (egroups, topica,...)? The Krusty Motorsports server (aka, digest.net) was explicitly to provide for efficient management of the various automotive mailing lists, done the way that the owner of the server wanted it done. Any migration off of the server (which is already bought, paid for, and configured) would create any number of issues. 8. How do i contact the Server Administrator in an emergency? If my regular email address (rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com) isn't working for you, you can fall back on rwelty-at-suespammers.org 9. What is Krusty Motorsports, anyway? Krusty Motorsports (http:/www.krusty-motorsports.com/) is a business which is owned and operated by Richard Welty (rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com). Krusty is an S-Corporation in the State of New York. Krusty provides a number of Internet related services, such as mailing list, web sites, pop3/telnet accounts, and consulting on internet related issues. For more information, see the web site. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:04:31 +0000 From: michel balea Subject: RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility Neat, sometimes... we wonder.... Shouldn't we move those servers in Alaska for the summer and move them south for the winter ..... Fighting global warming one gram of CO2 at a time..... Right... how do we move them..... need my tea.... phone rang at 5 am..... arggggh Michel 74 wag..... may be i will add how many tons of carbons i generated last year vs. this year..... > Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:07:00 -0800 > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; xj-at-digest.net; fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility > > if you ever wonder why wagoneers.com is so fast, it's the datacenter... > (well, and Linux and Apache, but it's the network that makes it work so well...) > > the digital forest in Seattle... a worldclass facility. it's one > of the finest data centers I've ever been in... if you're looking for > a colocation facility you need to check these guys out. > > ran across the video of them putting in additional HVAC during an upgrade, > http://www.forest.net/support/ it's down near the bottom... > > cool stuff... (no pun intended). :) > > john > > ----- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook ^V together at last. Get it now. http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971 033 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:01:59 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility why not move them north during the winter to help heat homes? ;) then move them to Australia and New Zealand for the "summer" so they heat homes down there... :) seriously, what we need to do is reclaim the heat we generate for useful purposes... of course the losses associated with transfering it often overcome any benefits... Of course years ago I recall seeing something about storing heat from a/c underground and then reusing it in the winter. Not sure how that worked out. Just think, if we could store the heat from our engines, get home and then plug into to our house and transfer all that waste heat energy into our homes for use... not exactly a desirable thing in SoCal or Arizona, but other places it might be welcome... Think back, way back, to the engineering feat attempted in Laodicea, a wee bit before our time... but they were going to setup hot and cold running water... all they got was luke warm... We know about it because in Revelation 3:16 there is a reference to it... :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, michel balea wrote: # Neat, sometimes... we wonder.... Shouldn't we move those servers in Alaska for # the summer and move them south for the winter ..... Fighting global warming # one gram of CO2 at a time..... Right... how do we move them..... need my # tea.... phone rang at 5 am..... arggggh # # Michel # 74 wag..... may be i will add how many tons of carbons i generated last year # vs. this year..... # # # # # # > Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:07:00 -0800 # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; xj-at-digest.net; # fsj-at-digest.net # > Subject: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility # > # > if you ever wonder why wagoneers.com is so fast, it's the datacenter... # > (well, and Linux and Apache, but it's the network that makes it work so # well...) # > # > the digital forest in Seattle... a worldclass facility. it's one # > of the finest data centers I've ever been in... if you're looking for # > a colocation facility you need to check these guys out. # > # > ran across the video of them putting in additional HVAC during an upgrade, # > http://www.forest.net/support/ it's down near the bottom... # > # > cool stuff... (no pun intended). :) # > # > john # > # > ----- # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # _________________________________________________________________ # Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook ^V together at last. Get it # now. # http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971 # 033 # ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:23:48 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility they have some great wheeling up there too... if you like driving on glaciers... :) hey, how come no one is complaining about the heat created by geothermal and volcanoes??? ;) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, Stephen Rigley wrote: # The future for the big players (if they've got any sense ) # # http://www.invest.is/Key-Sectors/Data-Centers-in-Iceland/ # # Electricity is v.cheap (geothermal power). # # Steve # # On Nov 15, 2007 5:01 PM, john wrote: # > Think back, way back, to the engineering feat attempted in Laodicea, # > a wee bit before our time... but they were going to setup hot and # > cold running water... all they got was luke warm... We know about # > it because in Revelation 3:16 there is a reference to it... :) # > # > john # > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 17:27:45 +0000 From: michel balea Subject: RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility > Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:01:59 -0800 > From: john Just think, if we could store the heat from our engines, get home > and then plug into to our house and transfer all that waste heat > energy into our homes for use... not exactly a desirable thing > in SoCal or Arizona, but other places it might be welcome... Actually we do that.... those V8s (4.0L in the big car and a 4.5L in little car) accumulate so much heat... that the garage is like a turkish bath.... but the house insulation prevents heat transfer.... so the gas tank for the emergency generator in the garage tends to evaporate. the same principle that helps you heat your house... just leave the fridge door opened.... and the condenser will quick in.... not a very nice way to warm up the place.... Michel _________________________________________________________________ Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne ws ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 09:31:25 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: xj: RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility corrosion, rust, sedimentation, impurities, friction, thermal losses... all signs of a fallen world... and just another engineering challenge to exercise our creativity... :) there's a solution for every problem, but the problem is can we afford the solution? ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, Ed Kummel wrote: # Back in the '80s, an architect that my parents purchased a townhouse from was planning a new townhouse development. The new development would consist of 52 units surrounding a 5 acre pond that is 13 feet at it's deepest point. The pond would have a water chanel that ran in front of the houses as a kind of moat and feed back into the main body of water in the back with the back of the houses facing the pond. # What was interesting in his design was that the pond water was going to be used to supplement the heating and cooling of the townhouse units. Unfortunatly, it was determined that while the implementation of the idea was not that expensive, the maintenance, upkeep and upgrading of the system would have been prohibitively unfeasable. So, no heat exchangers in the water...although some of the houses did get the moat! # Ed # web/gadget guru # # john wrote: # why not move them north during the winter to help heat homes? ;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:40:10 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility cool stuff... no pun intended... :) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com * ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- * there's a solution for every problem; problem is can we afford the solution? - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, chuck goolsbee wrote: # >seriously, what we need to do is reclaim the heat we generate for # >useful purposes... # # In our case, we do. The heat from the facility is pulled out via hot-air # return ducts and brought back to the HVAC systems to be used in making cold # air. # # The only time we exhaust it is when it is much colder outside than the ideal # temperature inside (~650F). In that situation we don't have to "make" cold # air, we just pull it from outside. In this region, that is the smart way to # do it since it is so cool and mild. It consumes MUCH less electricity since # all we are running is fans. The rule of thumb in datacenter design is for # every amp going to the servers 1.5/2 amps are used in cooling. That is not # the case for us 60% of the year. Our ratio is more like 1:0.4 from October to # June, and variable the rest of the year. At our peak usage it comes close to # 1:1. # # Mind you our exhaust is not exactly "hot" either... maybe 770F tops. # # Only when we fire up the generator (ObDieselContent) do we put out serious # heat. # # Oh, and thanks for the props John! =) # # # ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:27:23 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: xj: Re: [db] RE: fsj: OT: datacenter/colocation facility http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qza9DIMiZuU very cool, saw this on Top Gear years ago... ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com * ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- * there's a solution for every problem; problem is can we afford the solution? - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # > they have some great wheeling up there too... if you like # > driving on glaciers... :) # > hey, how come no one is complaining about the heat created # > by geothermal and volcanoes??? ;) # > # > ----- # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, Stephen Rigley wrote: # > # > # The future for the big players (if they've got any sense ) # > # # > # http://www.invest.is/Key-Sectors/Data-Centers-in-Iceland/ # > # # > # Electricity is v.cheap (geothermal power). # > # # > # Steve # > # # > # On Nov 15, 2007 5:01 PM, john wrote: # > # > # > Think back, way back, to the engineering feat attempted in Laodicea, # > # > a wee bit before our time... but they were going to setup hot and # > # > cold running water... all they got was luke warm... We know about # > # > it because in Revelation 3:16 there is a reference to it... :) # > # > # > # > john # > # > # ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2954 **************************