From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Apr 8 16:41:07 2008 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, April 8 2008 Volume 01 : Number 3046 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer fsj: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer fsj: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer fsj: RE: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 16:01:07 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer weight of the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is 650 lbs. I have heard of a 6BT being put in a Wagoneer... very little clearance underhood or above the axle... it was tight with the 6.2. The AMC 360 that came out weighed 640lbs if I recall correctly, give or take a bit... posted the accurate details earlier to the list. I got the weight out of a Technical manual for the engine. :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # John; # # I would think that with the lift you'd have the height for either a 6BT or a # 4BT. There are a couple of outfits that make conversion pcs to fit them # into GM and Ford trucks. # # Having towed with diesel pickups for a long time I find that the Cummins in # the Dodge seems to pull better and get better fuel mileage. Same trailer # and load over the same route. The Ford and Chevy got 7-8 miles to the # gallon less than the Dodge, And the Dodge was quicker. # # The Cummins 6BT is 906 lbs and the 4BT is 705, I think the 6.2 is about 830 # lbs. So the weights are pretty close. The Cummins is taller. # # Bob # # -----Original Message----- # From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 5:59 PM # To: Bob Brooks # Cc: full size jeep list # Subject: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # the cummins is too tall, too heavy and too loud. # # I'm not familiar with the Ford/IH Diesels. # # I've had a few 6.2's and have been happy with them... they're # not powerhouses but they are affordable and reliable. # # john # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # John: # # # # The Jeep looks really nice, congrats on the first outing!!! # # # # Just curious do you still think the 6.2 is the right engine for this jeep # or # # would a Cummins or Ford/ International have been better? # # # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # john # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 2:12 PM # # To: undisclosed-recipients: # # Subject: fsj: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # 8 April 2008 # # # # Drove my 1991 Jeep Grand Wagoneer with the 6.2L Diesel to work. # # # # ...and parked next to a Ford Diesel, makes it clear why I built my Jeep # # instead # # of buying what is already a Diesel: # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/firstcommute.jpg # # # # Topped off the main tank on the way in. Still have one injector that may # be # # misfiring, # # hoping it will clear on it's own. Optimistic about the fuel economy... # # we'll see... :) # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/AL # # L.html # # # # individual pictures: # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/ # # # # # # Here's some shots of the passenger side leaf spring install... My son # and I # # did # # the driver's side last night in a very short time. The welded nut on the # # frame # # was in place, and stayed, thanks to NO RUST, despite being 17 years old. # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ALL # # .html # # individual pictures: # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ # # # # # # Was a great feeling, but there still work to be done... :) # # of course, the list is getting shorter: seats, a/c, cruise, stereo, # # lights... :) # # more pictures: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # # # # john meister # # # # ----- # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 19:04:07 -0400 From: "Bob Brooks" Subject: fsj: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer John: I didn't realize that the 6.2 was that light. I have a list here and it says 830, I'm not sure where it came from, 650 actually makes more sense. So it's about the same as a SBC. I've always thought a diesel FSJ would be the perfect vehicle! Good luck with yours. I'd love to find a rust free example but out here on the east coast everything I've seen is pretty rusty! Bob - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 7:01 PM To: Bob Brooks Cc: diesel-benz list; 'full size jeep list' Subject: fsj: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer weight of the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is 650 lbs. I have heard of a 6BT being put in a Wagoneer... very little clearance underhood or above the axle... it was tight with the 6.2. The AMC 360 that came out weighed 640lbs if I recall correctly, give or take a bit... posted the accurate details earlier to the list. I got the weight out of a Technical manual for the engine. :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # John; # # I would think that with the lift you'd have the height for either a 6BT or a # 4BT. There are a couple of outfits that make conversion pcs to fit them # into GM and Ford trucks. # # Having towed with diesel pickups for a long time I find that the Cummins in # the Dodge seems to pull better and get better fuel mileage. Same trailer # and load over the same route. The Ford and Chevy got 7-8 miles to the # gallon less than the Dodge, And the Dodge was quicker. # # The Cummins 6BT is 906 lbs and the 4BT is 705, I think the 6.2 is about 830 # lbs. So the weights are pretty close. The Cummins is taller. # # Bob # # -----Original Message----- # From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 5:59 PM # To: Bob Brooks # Cc: full size jeep list # Subject: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # the cummins is too tall, too heavy and too loud. # # I'm not familiar with the Ford/IH Diesels. # # I've had a few 6.2's and have been happy with them... they're # not powerhouses but they are affordable and reliable. # # john # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # John: # # # # The Jeep looks really nice, congrats on the first outing!!! # # # # Just curious do you still think the 6.2 is the right engine for this jeep # or # # would a Cummins or Ford/ International have been better? # # # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # john # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 2:12 PM # # To: undisclosed-recipients: # # Subject: fsj: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # 8 April 2008 # # # # Drove my 1991 Jeep Grand Wagoneer with the 6.2L Diesel to work. # # # # ...and parked next to a Ford Diesel, makes it clear why I built my Jeep # # instead # # of buying what is already a Diesel: # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/firstcommute.jpg # # # # Topped off the main tank on the way in. Still have one injector that may # be # # misfiring, # # hoping it will clear on it's own. Optimistic about the fuel economy... # # we'll see... :) # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/AL # # L.html # # # # individual pictures: # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/ # # # # # # Here's some shots of the passenger side leaf spring install... My son # and I # # did # # the driver's side last night in a very short time. The welded nut on the # # frame # # was in place, and stayed, thanks to NO RUST, despite being 17 years old. # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ALL # # .html # # individual pictures: # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ # # # # # # Was a great feeling, but there still work to be done... :) # # of course, the list is getting shorter: seats, a/c, cruise, stereo, # # lights... :) # # more pictures: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # # # # john meister # # # # ----- # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 16:14:09 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer You missed out, I had a nice '89 GW that needed some interior work, body was absolutely perfect... :) I love it out here... no salt, no rust... but also, not much sun. :) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # John: # # I didn't realize that the 6.2 was that light. I have a list here and it # says 830, I'm not sure where it came from, 650 actually makes more sense. # So it's about the same as a SBC. # # I've always thought a diesel FSJ would be the perfect vehicle! Good luck # with yours. I'd love to find a rust free example but out here on the east # coast everything I've seen is pretty rusty! # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 7:01 PM # To: Bob Brooks # Cc: diesel-benz list; 'full size jeep list' # Subject: fsj: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # weight of the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is 650 lbs. # # I have heard of a 6BT being put in a Wagoneer... very little clearance # underhood or above the axle... it was tight with the 6.2. # # The AMC 360 that came out weighed 640lbs if I recall correctly, give # or take a bit... posted the accurate details earlier to the list. # # I got the weight out of a Technical manual for the engine. :) # # john # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # John; # # # # I would think that with the lift you'd have the height for either a 6BT # or a # # 4BT. There are a couple of outfits that make conversion pcs to fit them # # into GM and Ford trucks. # # # # Having towed with diesel pickups for a long time I find that the Cummins # in # # the Dodge seems to pull better and get better fuel mileage. Same trailer # # and load over the same route. The Ford and Chevy got 7-8 miles to the # # gallon less than the Dodge, And the Dodge was quicker. # # # # The Cummins 6BT is 906 lbs and the 4BT is 705, I think the 6.2 is about # 830 # # lbs. So the weights are pretty close. The Cummins is taller. # # # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # # From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 5:59 PM # # To: Bob Brooks # # Cc: full size jeep list # # Subject: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # the cummins is too tall, too heavy and too loud. # # # # I'm not familiar with the Ford/IH Diesels. # # # # I've had a few 6.2's and have been happy with them... they're # # not powerhouses but they are affordable and reliable. # # # # john # # # # ----- # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # # # John: # # # # # # The Jeep looks really nice, congrats on the first outing!!! # # # # # # Just curious do you still think the 6.2 is the right engine for this # jeep # # or # # # would a Cummins or Ford/ International have been better? # # # # # # Bob # # # # # # -----Original Message----- # # # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # # john # # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 2:12 PM # # # To: undisclosed-recipients: # # # Subject: fsj: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # # # 8 April 2008 # # # # # # Drove my 1991 Jeep Grand Wagoneer with the 6.2L Diesel to work. # # # # # # ...and parked next to a Ford Diesel, makes it clear why I built my # Jeep # # # instead # # # of buying what is already a Diesel: # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/firstcommute.jpg # # # # # # Topped off the main tank on the way in. Still have one injector that # may # # be # # # misfiring, # # # hoping it will clear on it's own. Optimistic about the fuel # economy... # # # we'll see... :) # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/AL # # # L.html # # # # # # individual pictures: # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/ # # # # # # # # # Here's some shots of the passenger side leaf spring install... My son # # and I # # # did # # # the driver's side last night in a very short time. The welded nut on # the # # # frame # # # was in place, and stayed, thanks to NO RUST, despite being 17 years # old. # # # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ALL # # # .html # # # individual pictures: # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ # # # # # # # # # Was a great feeling, but there still work to be done... :) # # # of course, the list is getting shorter: seats, a/c, cruise, stereo, # # # lights... :) # # # more pictures: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # # # # # # john meister # # # # # # ----- # # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # # # # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 19:33:10 -0400 From: "Bob Brooks" Subject: fsj: RE: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer John; Problem is it's so costly to move them out to NY. Actually for the right vehicle it might be worth it. I hate fixing rust damage! I'd consider the move out that way, but Joan would never move out there! Bob - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 7:14 PM To: Bob Brooks Cc: 'diesel-benz list'; 'full size jeep list' Subject: fsj: RE: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer You missed out, I had a nice '89 GW that needed some interior work, body was absolutely perfect... :) I love it out here... no salt, no rust... but also, not much sun. :) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # John: # # I didn't realize that the 6.2 was that light. I have a list here and it # says 830, I'm not sure where it came from, 650 actually makes more sense. # So it's about the same as a SBC. # # I've always thought a diesel FSJ would be the perfect vehicle! Good luck # with yours. I'd love to find a rust free example but out here on the east # coast everything I've seen is pretty rusty! # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 7:01 PM # To: Bob Brooks # Cc: diesel-benz list; 'full size jeep list' # Subject: fsj: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # weight of the 6.2L Detroit Diesel is 650 lbs. # # I have heard of a 6BT being put in a Wagoneer... very little clearance # underhood or above the axle... it was tight with the 6.2. # # The AMC 360 that came out weighed 640lbs if I recall correctly, give # or take a bit... posted the accurate details earlier to the list. # # I got the weight out of a Technical manual for the engine. :) # # john # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://wagoneers.com ** http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # John; # # # # I would think that with the lift you'd have the height for either a 6BT # or a # # 4BT. There are a couple of outfits that make conversion pcs to fit them # # into GM and Ford trucks. # # # # Having towed with diesel pickups for a long time I find that the Cummins # in # # the Dodge seems to pull better and get better fuel mileage. Same trailer # # and load over the same route. The Ford and Chevy got 7-8 miles to the # # gallon less than the Dodge, And the Dodge was quicker. # # # # The Cummins 6BT is 906 lbs and the 4BT is 705, I think the 6.2 is about # 830 # # lbs. So the weights are pretty close. The Cummins is taller. # # # # Bob # # # # -----Original Message----- # # From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 5:59 PM # # To: Bob Brooks # # Cc: full size jeep list # # Subject: RE: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # the cummins is too tall, too heavy and too loud. # # # # I'm not familiar with the Ford/IH Diesels. # # # # I've had a few 6.2's and have been happy with them... they're # # not powerhouses but they are affordable and reliable. # # # # john # # # # ----- # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # # # # On Tue, 8 Apr 2008, Bob Brooks wrote: # # # # # John: # # # # # # The Jeep looks really nice, congrats on the first outing!!! # # # # # # Just curious do you still think the 6.2 is the right engine for this # jeep # # or # # # would a Cummins or Ford/ International have been better? # # # # # # Bob # # # # # # -----Original Message----- # # # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # # john # # # Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 2:12 PM # # # To: undisclosed-recipients: # # # Subject: fsj: first commute with the Diesel 1991 Grand Wagoneer # # # # # # 8 April 2008 # # # # # # Drove my 1991 Jeep Grand Wagoneer with the 6.2L Diesel to work. # # # # # # ...and parked next to a Ford Diesel, makes it clear why I built my # Jeep # # # instead # # # of buying what is already a Diesel: # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/firstcommute.jpg # # # # # # Topped off the main tank on the way in. Still have one injector that # may # # be # # # misfiring, # # # hoping it will clear on it's own. Optimistic about the fuel # economy... # # # we'll see... :) # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/AL # # # L.html # # # # # # individual pictures: # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/first_commute/ # # # # # # # # # Here's some shots of the passenger side leaf spring install... My son # # and I # # # did # # # the driver's side last night in a very short time. The welded nut on # the # # # frame # # # was in place, and stayed, thanks to NO RUST, despite being 17 years # old. # # # # # # # # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ALL # # # .html # # # individual pictures: # # # # # # # http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/04-Apr-08-Omega-1st-commute/rear-springs/ # # # # # # # # # Was a great feeling, but there still work to be done... :) # # # of course, the list is getting shorter: seats, a/c, cruise, stereo, # # # lights... :) # # # more pictures: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # # # # # # john meister # # # # # # ----- # # # - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # # # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # # # - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # # # # # ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #3046 **************************