From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Fri Jan 16 22:20:45 2009 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Saturday, January 17 2009 Volume 01 : Number 3244 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures fsj: OT: flood pictures fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures Re: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures RE: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 15:31:40 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures # Here's your Diesel XJ: # oh, yes, it all looked quite good... until I got to this page: http://www.jaguar.co.uk/uk/en/xj/models_pricing/pricing.htm :) that's only the beginning of issues though... didn't see an effective four wheel drive system and lift kit listed. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, chuck goolsbee wrote: # On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 14:10:40 -0800 (PST), john wrote: # > another possibility that makes more sense than the 300GD is to get a nice # > XJ and make it a Diesel... # # Here's your Diesel XJ: # # # 2.7L twin turbo V6, top speed 141 MPH. # # Drive it in comfort and style from Basel to Blackpool on one tank! # # # # # --chuck goolsbee # 02 Jetta TDi & 06 Liberty CRD # arlington, wa, usa # # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:22:51 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: fsj: OT: flood pictures just got this powerpoint from a friend: http://wagoneers.com/MISC/History/WASHINGTON_2009_Flood.pps these are some of mine... drove across the valley for the first time yesterday, can see the damage to the ditches and fences in the valley, still slowing traffic down significantly: http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2009/01-Jan-08-and-09-SnohomishValleyFlood/ALL.html ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:28:32 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures I agree... all of the G-Wagens of the affordable, importable models had the 88 PS naturally aspirated 5 cylinder Diesel, and usually manual trans. totally gutless, limited top speed... no a/c, no cruise, no power windows, etc. I've thought about converting a WJ to Diesel, but all the computers it uses to do simple things complicates that process... there are so many computers involved to do pretty much anything, at least three that I know of for the seat heaters! Importing a WJ isn't cost effective and there are other issues with a WJ, mainly size and visibility, the XJ is perferred. A Mercedes Diesel in an FSJ would make it on par for performance with a 300GD. In other words, not good... no towing capability or freeway performance. Building up a nice Cherokee (XJ) with a Mercedes Diesel does sound like a good project... KNOWN ISSUES with this idea are: - oil pan and front axle/steering arm are at odds. - adapter to mate transfer case or transmission need to be made otherwise, it's a great idea. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, Alec Cordova wrote: # I'm starting to think the vast majority of the diesel G-wagens that # made it to the US used the non-turbo engines. I know the 280GE of the # 80's that used the straight 6 gasser was detuned compared to that # engine in the sedans. This could really affect their use as all # purpose daily drivers. # # And if you're going to retrofit an MB turbodiesel into a vehicle # anyway, you might as well put it into a Jeep just to satisfy that side # of you. I would think one of the nice gussied-up 4-door XJ Cherokees # with an inline 5 or 6 cylinder MB turbodiesel would probably make the # best daily driver. An older FSJ is probably too big and heavy for # these engines, and if you want a WJ, just find a way to get a euro # model with the V6 TD where all the integration work is nicely done for # you. That just leaves adapting the Benz engine, possibly with MB # tranny, to four wheel drive. # # Alec # # On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:10 PM, john wrote: # > trying to decide if I want to focus my energies on rebuilding and enhancing my J10, or # > just keeping the Blazer... or ditching both and getting a 300GD... # > # > http://wagoneers.com/john/the-3rd.html # > # > another possibility that makes more sense than the 300GD is to get a nice XJ and # > make it a Diesel... 4 doors, practical... economical... and best of all... a JEEP. :) # > # > john # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2009 01:43:52 +0000 From: Michel Balea Subject: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures Decisions, and more thoughts. In the last 8 days from San Fran to the Mexican border and back north by the eastern sierras.... about 1500 miles.... I did not see a single wagoneer, J truck... even on blocks.... The only ones are at the recycling yard or on CL. It is getting more difficult to find good donors. Even XJs can now be counted to 10ish. In fact usually you have more merc, volvos, bmws and saabs, than FSJs... must be the bay area demographics. The other day some teens stopped by and ask me what vehicle the Jeep was..... The funny thing is that I rarely see toyota pickup trucks.... sometimes a land rover shows up.... today it was a toasty one. Cheers Michel > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:28:32 -0800 > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > To: benzaholic-at-gmail.com > CC: xj-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures > > I agree... all of the G-Wagens of the affordable, importable models had > the 88 PS naturally aspirated 5 cylinder Diesel, and usually manual trans. > totally gutless, limited top speed... no a/c, no cruise, no power windows, etc. > > I've thought about converting a WJ to Diesel, but all the computers it > uses to do simple things complicates that process... there are so many > computers involved to do pretty much anything, at least three that > I know of for the seat heaters! Importing a WJ isn't cost effective > and there are other issues with a WJ, mainly size and visibility, the > XJ is perferred. A Mercedes Diesel in an FSJ would make it on par > for performance with a 300GD. In other words, not good... no towing > capability or freeway performance. > > Building up a nice Cherokee (XJ) with a Mercedes Diesel does sound like > a good project... > > KNOWN ISSUES with this idea are: > - oil pan and front axle/steering arm are at odds. > - adapter to mate transfer case or transmission need to be made > > otherwise, it's a great idea. ;) > > john > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, Alec Cordova wrote: > > # I'm starting to think the vast majority of the diesel G-wagens that > # made it to the US used the non-turbo engines. I know the 280GE of the > # 80's that used the straight 6 gasser was detuned compared to that > # engine in the sedans. This could really affect their use as all > # purpose daily drivers. > # > # And if you're going to retrofit an MB turbodiesel into a vehicle > # anyway, you might as well put it into a Jeep just to satisfy that side > # of you. I would think one of the nice gussied-up 4-door XJ Cherokees > # with an inline 5 or 6 cylinder MB turbodiesel would probably make the > # best daily driver. An older FSJ is probably too big and heavy for > # these engines, and if you want a WJ, just find a way to get a euro > # model with the V6 TD where all the integration work is nicely done for > # you. That just leaves adapting the Benz engine, possibly with MB > # tranny, to four wheel drive. > # > # Alec > # > # On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:10 PM, john wrote: > # > trying to decide if I want to focus my energies on rebuilding and enhancing my J10, or > # > just keeping the Blazer... or ditching both and getting a 300GD... > # > > # > http://wagoneers.com/john/the-3rd.html > # > > # > another possibility that makes more sense than the 300GD is to get a nice XJ and > # > make it a Diesel... 4 doors, practical... economical... and best of all... a JEEP. :) > # > > # > john > # > > # > ----- > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com > # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf > # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > > # _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live^Y: Keep your life in sync. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:21:35 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures this makes me think that keeping my J10 is a very, very good idea... thanx. with it I can also get rid of my trailer... '99 wj, '91 300d and my '83 J10 stepside... I like it. john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 17 Jan 2009, Michel Balea wrote: # Decisions, and more thoughts. # # In the last 8 days from San Fran to the Mexican border and back north by the # eastern sierras.... about 1500 miles.... I did not see a single wagoneer, J # truck... even on blocks.... The only ones are at the recycling yard or on CL. # It is getting more difficult to find good donors. Even XJs can now be counted # to 10ish. In fact usually you have more merc, volvos, bmws and saabs, than # FSJs... must be the bay area demographics. # # The other day some teens stopped by and ask me what vehicle the Jeep was..... # # The funny thing is that I rarely see toyota pickup trucks.... sometimes a land # rover shows up.... today it was a toasty one. # # Cheers # # Michel # # > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:28:32 -0800 # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > To: benzaholic-at-gmail.com # > CC: xj-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net; # diesel-benz-at-digest.net # > Subject: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures # > # > I agree... all of the G-Wagens of the affordable, importable models had # > the 88 PS naturally aspirated 5 cylinder Diesel, and usually manual trans. # > totally gutless, limited top speed... no a/c, no cruise, no power windows, # etc. # > # > I've thought about converting a WJ to Diesel, but all the computers it # > uses to do simple things complicates that process... there are so many # > computers involved to do pretty much anything, at least three that # > I know of for the seat heaters! Importing a WJ isn't cost effective # > and there are other issues with a WJ, mainly size and visibility, the # > XJ is perferred. A Mercedes Diesel in an FSJ would make it on par # > for performance with a 300GD. In other words, not good... no towing # > capability or freeway performance. # > # > Building up a nice Cherokee (XJ) with a Mercedes Diesel does sound like # > a good project... # > # > KNOWN ISSUES with this idea are: # > - oil pan and front axle/steering arm are at odds. # > - adapter to mate transfer case or transmission need to be made # > # > otherwise, it's a great idea. ;) # > # > john # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, Alec Cordova wrote: # > # > # I'm starting to think the vast majority of the diesel G-wagens that # > # made it to the US used the non-turbo engines. I know the 280GE of the # > # 80's that used the straight 6 gasser was detuned compared to that # > # engine in the sedans. This could really affect their use as all # > # purpose daily drivers. # > # # > # And if you're going to retrofit an MB turbodiesel into a vehicle # > # anyway, you might as well put it into a Jeep just to satisfy that side # > # of you. I would think one of the nice gussied-up 4-door XJ Cherokees # > # with an inline 5 or 6 cylinder MB turbodiesel would probably make the # > # best daily driver. An older FSJ is probably too big and heavy for # > # these engines, and if you want a WJ, just find a way to get a euro # > # model with the V6 TD where all the integration work is nicely done for # > # you. That just leaves adapting the Benz engine, possibly with MB # > # tranny, to four wheel drive. # > # # > # Alec # > # # > # On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:10 PM, john wrote: # > # > trying to decide if I want to focus my energies on rebuilding and # enhancing my J10, or # > # > just keeping the Blazer... or ditching both and getting a 300GD... # > # > # > # > http://wagoneers.com/john/the-3rd.html # > # > # > # > another possibility that makes more sense than the 300GD is to get a # nice XJ and # > # > make it a Diesel... 4 doors, practical... economical... and best of # all... a JEEP. :) # > # > # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > # > # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > # > # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > # # # _________________________________________________________________ # Windows Live^Y: Keep your life in sync. # http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009 # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 22:20:01 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures what I need to do is figure out how to mate a Mercedes Diesel to either a T-5, a T-18 or better, an Aisin Warner 30-80LE (aka AW4). I have a custom adapter to mate the AW4 (xj tranny) to an SJ xfr case. Putting the J10 together with 3.54 axles and a good 4.2L will get it back running an usable... then I can find a Mercedes Diesel and figure out how to adapt it to the Jeep transmission and swap it in later. john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 17 Jan 2009, Michel Balea wrote: # # Keep the J10, it is easier to work on, no major electronic parts to fail, the module or the dizzy. # # This is why i like the FSJs.... I have one of each... and a fuel pump.... and some jumper wires..... I was tempted by the new stuff.... yes the Toy word.... but they are tiny.... and their mileage is not that fantastic. # # In my case still trying to decide on keeping the trusty 74 or upgrading to the 85 who is marking it territory.... engine, trany, TC. At least the trany seems to drip when resting for extended time.... the engine oil drain plug needs the real gasket and not sure about the TC, the dye seems to indicate that it is coming from the trany. The real leak are the valve seals.... my next education: changing the valve seals w the head still on the engine..... # # cheers # # Michel # # > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:21:35 -0800 # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > To: mbalea-at-hotmail.com # > CC: xj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net # > Subject: Re: fsj: RE: fsj [db] popcorn adventures # > # > this makes me think that keeping my J10 is a very, very good idea... thanx. # > # > with it I can also get rid of my trailer... # > # > '99 wj, '91 300d and my '83 J10 stepside... I like it. # > # > john # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > On Sat, 17 Jan 2009, Michel Balea wrote: # > # > # Decisions, and more thoughts. # > # # > # In the last 8 days from San Fran to the Mexican border and back north by the # > # eastern sierras.... about 1500 miles.... I did not see a single wagoneer, J # > # truck... even on blocks.... The only ones are at the recycling yard or on CL. # > # It is getting more difficult to find good donors. Even XJs can now be counted # > # to 10ish. In fact usually you have more merc, volvos, bmws and saabs, than # > # FSJs... must be the bay area demographics. # > # # > # The other day some teens stopped by and ask me what vehicle the Jeep was..... # > # # > # The funny thing is that I rarely see toyota pickup trucks.... sometimes a land # > # rover shows up.... today it was a toasty one. # > # # > # Cheers # > # # > # Michel # > # # > # > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:28:32 -0800 # > # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > # > To: benzaholic-at-gmail.com # > # > CC: xj-at-digest.net; WJ-Grand-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net; # > # diesel-benz-at-digest.net # > # > Subject: fsj: Re: [db] popcorn adventures # > # > # > # > I agree... all of the G-Wagens of the affordable, importable models had # > # > the 88 PS naturally aspirated 5 cylinder Diesel, and usually manual trans. # > # > totally gutless, limited top speed... no a/c, no cruise, no power windows, # > # etc. # > # > # > # > I've thought about converting a WJ to Diesel, but all the computers it # > # > uses to do simple things complicates that process... there are so many # > # > computers involved to do pretty much anything, at least three that # > # > I know of for the seat heaters! Importing a WJ isn't cost effective # > # > and there are other issues with a WJ, mainly size and visibility, the # > # > XJ is perferred. A Mercedes Diesel in an FSJ would make it on par # > # > for performance with a 300GD. In other words, not good... no towing # > # > capability or freeway performance. # > # > # > # > Building up a nice Cherokee (XJ) with a Mercedes Diesel does sound like # > # > a good project... # > # > # > # > KNOWN ISSUES with this idea are: # > # > - oil pan and front axle/steering arm are at odds. # > # > - adapter to mate transfer case or transmission need to be made # > # > # > # > otherwise, it's a great idea. ;) # > # > # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > # > # > # > On Fri, 16 Jan 2009, Alec Cordova wrote: # > # > # > # > # I'm starting to think the vast majority of the diesel G-wagens that # > # > # made it to the US used the non-turbo engines. I know the 280GE of the # > # > # 80's that used the straight 6 gasser was detuned compared to that # > # > # engine in the sedans. This could really affect their use as all # > # > # purpose daily drivers. # > # > # # > # > # And if you're going to retrofit an MB turbodiesel into a vehicle # > # > # anyway, you might as well put it into a Jeep just to satisfy that side # > # > # of you. I would think one of the nice gussied-up 4-door XJ Cherokees # > # > # with an inline 5 or 6 cylinder MB turbodiesel would probably make the # > # > # best daily driver. An older FSJ is probably too big and heavy for # > # > # these engines, and if you want a WJ, just find a way to get a euro # > # > # model with the V6 TD where all the integration work is nicely done for # > # > # you. That just leaves adapting the Benz engine, possibly with MB # > # > # tranny, to four wheel drive. # > # > # # > # > # Alec # > # > # # > # > # On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 4:10 PM, john wrote: # > # > # > trying to decide if I want to focus my energies on rebuilding and # > # enhancing my J10, or # > # > # > just keeping the Blazer... or ditching both and getting a 300GD... # > # > # > # > # > # > http://wagoneers.com/john/the-3rd.html # > # > # > # > # > # > another possibility that makes more sense than the 300GD is to get a # > # nice XJ and # > # > # > make it a Diesel... 4 doors, practical... economical... and best of # > # all... a JEEP. :) # > # > # > # > # > # > john # > # > # > # > # > # > ----- # > # > # > # > # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > # > # > http://johnmeister.com/fotomeister - Trust Jesus: http://freegift.com # > # > # > SAVE power, avoid viruses, use LINUX: http://johnmeister.com/tmcp.pdf # > # > # > SAVE fuel, use synthetics: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > # > # > # > # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > # > # > # # > # # > # _________________________________________________________________ # > # Windows Live^Y: Keep your life in sync. # > # http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009 # > # # # _________________________________________________________________ # Windows Live(TM): Keep your life in sync. # http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009 ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #3244 **************************