From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Sat Jul 3 23:18:13 2010 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Sunday, July 4 2010 Volume 01 : Number 3597 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: fsj: The project moves fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts Re: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts RE: fsj: Making a mess of tranny fluid FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 19:35:05 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: Re: fsj: The project moves They aren't too hard to come by. I have a small pile to go through soon to get all my project rigs ready for the road, and then the rest will be on the for sale pile. (I already have a set of nearly brand new 31/10.50/15 Wildcat EXTs that I posted on CL, but some J/A keeps killing the ad) I just got back from visiting the kids and grandkids up in BC and I will be getting the '83 J10 longbox ready to go up (my son will use it for parts) and part out the '76 shortbox to get what I need to get my Honcho running. (The J20 axles are being delivered local) Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 From: Kim Tesar Subject: Re: fsj: The project moves Will you need custom driveshafts? If stock, where would you look for them? Mine in front is real sloppy. I'm going to go measure. - - - Landon ////// _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the too busy. Combine all your e-mail accounts with Hotmail. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?tile=multiaccount&ocid=PID2832 6::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_4 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Jul 2010 23:10:48 -0400 From: wallacem7-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts I too have a sloppy front driveshaft. So sloppy that it has resided on workbenches in three different states. Surprisingly it's actually in the Jeep right now. I have replaced my double cardan joint two or three times, but they don't last. Last time I played with the driveshaft It appeared that the spline had some play in it...I suspect this is why my double cardan joints don't last. That being said if your spline is okay the double cardan is not too hard to replace...you have to put the assembly together in the correct order...little more complicated than a regular u-joint. The parts are maybe $60. My long term solution is going to be having a new driveshaft made. Now, my rear driveshaft is a slightly different story. It is nice and tight, still has it's original U-joints at 235,000 miles. It was at last check exactly 3/8 of an inch too short. After spending some quality time with the tape measure I determined that the centering pin in my leaf springs was back about 3/4 of an inch from where it was on my last set of leaf springs. I also decided that at full compression I was going to have tire in my sheet metal. So after a lot of thinking about it...where I have had leaf springs crack in the past (not on the spring perch), and that a round hole doesn't really make very bad stress concentrations anyway; I decided to disassemble the spring packs and re-drill the top three leaves and re-assemble the spring packs. A quick check of the internet says I am not the only person to have done this, and Apparently it has been done with success in the past. So I proceeded to spend the better part of a weekend drilling holes, one side is done, and the other side I have two more drill sizes to go through on the passenger side though. Lot of thread cutting oil, and you pretty much have to sharpen the drill bit every 1/16th of an inch or so. So maybe this is my weekend to move the Jeep under it's own power. Been working a ton of hours which pays for the project, but doesn't give time for it. Mark 81 Wag ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 22:06:30 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts I would have re-drilled the spring pads on the axle and moved it forward, but that's me! Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 - ---------------------------------------- > To: fsj-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts > Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 23:10:48 -0400 > From: wallacem7-at-aol.com > > I too have a sloppy front driveshaft. So sloppy that it has resided on > workbenches in three different states. Surprisingly it's actually in the Jeep > right now. I have replaced my double cardan joint two or three times, but they > don't last. Last time I played with the driveshaft It appeared that the spline > had some play in it...I suspect this is why my double cardan joints don't > last. That being said if your spline is okay the double cardan is not too hard > to replace...you have to put the assembly together in the correct > order...little more complicated than a regular u-joint. The parts are maybe > $60. > > My long term solution is going to be having a new driveshaft made. > > Now, my rear driveshaft is a slightly different story. It is nice and tight, > still has it's original U-joints at 235,000 miles. It was at last check > exactly 3/8 of an inch too short. After spending some quality time with the > tape measure I determined that the centering pin in my leaf springs was back > about 3/4 of an inch from where it was on my last set of leaf springs. I also > decided that at full compression I was going to have tire in my sheet metal. > So after a lot of thinking about it...where I have had leaf springs crack in > the past (not on the spring perch), and that a round hole doesn't really make > very bad stress concentrations anyway; I decided to disassemble the spring > packs and re-drill the top three leaves and re-assemble the spring packs. A > quick check of the internet says I am not the only person to have done this, > and Apparently it has been done with success in the past. So I proceeded to > spend the better part of a weekend drilling holes, one side is done, and the > other side I have two more drill sizes to go through on the passenger side > though. Lot of thread cutting oil, and you pretty much have to sharpen the > drill bit every 1/16th of an inch or so. So maybe this is my weekend to move > the Jeep under it's own power. > > Been working a ton of hours which pays for the project, but doesn't give time > for it. > > Mark > 81 Wag _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL :en-US:WM_HMP:042010_2 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Jul 2010 01:25:10 -0400 From: wallacem7-at-aol.com Subject: Re: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts I actually considered that, but there was an issue of the wedges that put the axle at the right angle not fitting. I would have also had to make new U-bolt plates to capture the centering pin in a different location. I have always seen leaf springs crack (and I have cracked a few) outside of the U-bolt plate. I'll agree it's a bit of a risk, but it seemed like the best option. And when we get right down to it how many of us have made a modification or two that did not function as intended? If it doesn't work I will try something different. That being said drilling leaf springs is a lot of work and has not been real easy on this beat up body of mine. We'll see what the physical therapists say next week...probably gonna tell me that I shouldn't be working in a tile store either. Of course what do I have to complain about? I have a friend who built a hot rod Studebaker while he was recovering from a heart transplant who is egging me on on this little project. Mark 81 Wag - -----Original Message----- From: Jim Blair To: wallacem7-at-aol.com; fsj-digest-at-digest.net Sent: Fri, Jul 2, 2010 11:06 pm Subject: RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts I would have re-drilled the spring pads on the axle and moved it forward, but that's me! Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 - ---------------------------------------- > To: fsj-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts > Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 23:10:48 -0400 > From: wallacem7-at-aol.com > > I too have a sloppy front driveshaft. So sloppy that it has resided on > workbenches in three different states. Surprisingly it's actually in the Jeep > right now. I have replaced my double cardan joint two or three times, but they > don't last. Last time I played with the driveshaft It appeared that the spline > had some play in it...I suspect this is why my double cardan joints don't > last. That being said if your spline is okay the double cardan is not too hard > to replace...you have to put the assembly together in the correct > order...little more complicated than a regular u-joint. The parts are maybe > $60. > > My long term solution is going to be having a new driveshaft made. > > Now, my rear driveshaft is a slightly different story. It is nice and tight, > still has it's original U-joints at 235,000 miles. It was at last check > exactly 3/8 of an inch too short. After spending some quality time with the > tape measure I determined that the centering pin in my leaf springs was back > about 3/4 of an inch from where it was on my last set of leaf springs. I also > decided that at full compression I was going to have tire in my sheet metal. > So after a lot of thinking about it...where I have had leaf springs crack in > the past (not on the spring perch), and that a round hole doesn't really make > very bad stress concentrations anyway; I decided to disassemble the spring > packs and re-drill the top three leaves and re-assemble the spring packs. A > quick check of the internet says I am not the only person to have done this, > and Apparently it has been done with success in the past. So I proceeded to > spend the better part of a weekend drilling holes, one side is done, and the > other side I have two more drill sizes to go through on the passenger side > though. Lot of thread cutting oil, and you pretty much have to sharpen the > drill bit every 1/16th of an inch or so. So maybe this is my weekend to move > the Jeep under it's own power. > > Been working a ton of hours which pays for the project, but doesn't give time > for it. > > Mark > 81 Wag _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL :en-US:WM_HMP:042010_2= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 22:29:59 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts Then I would have drilled just the main leaf and shuffled the others forward 1/2 an inch or so. Probably really needed to be 1.5" forward for the sheet metal and full extension, hitting a stuff (been there, and it wasn't pretty!) Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 ________________________________ > To: carnuck-at-hotmail.com; fsj-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts > Date: Sat, 3 Jul 2010 01:25:10 -0400 > From: wallacem7-at-aol.com > > > > > > > > > > > I actually considered that, but there was an issue of the wedges that put the axle at the right angle not fitting. I would have also had to make new U-bolt plates to capture the centering pin in a different location. I have always seen leaf springs crack (and I have cracked a few) outside of the U-bolt plate. I'll agree it's a bit of a risk, but it seemed like the best option. And when we get right down to it how many of us have made a modification or two that did not function as intended? If it doesn't work I will try something different. > > > > That being said drilling leaf springs is a lot of work and has not been real easy on this beat up body of mine. We'll see what the physical therapists say next week...probably gonna tell me that I shouldn't be working in a tile store either. Of course what do I have to complain about? I have a friend who built a hot rod Studebaker while he was recovering from a heart transplant who is egging me on on this little project. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mark > > 81 Wag > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jim Blair > > > To: wallacem7-at-aol.com; fsj-digest-at-digest.net > > > Sent: Fri, Jul 2, 2010 11:06 pm > > > Subject: RE: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would have re-drilled the spring pads on the axle and moved it forward, but > > > that's me! > > > > > > > > > > > > Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------- > > >> To: fsj-digest-at-digest.net > > >> Subject: fsj: Sloppy front driveshafts > > >> Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2010 23:10:48 -0400 > > >> From: wallacem7-at-aol.com > > >> > > >> I too have a sloppy front driveshaft. So sloppy that it has resided on > > >> workbenches in three different states. Surprisingly it's actually in the Jeep > > >> right now. I have replaced my double cardan joint two or three times, but they > > >> don't last. Last time I played with the driveshaft It appeared that the spline > > >> had some play in it...I suspect this is why my double cardan joints don't > > >> last. That being said if your spline is okay the double cardan is not too hard > > >> to replace...you have to put the assembly together in the correct > > >> order...little more complicated than a regular u-joint. The parts are maybe > > >> $60. > > >> > > >> My long term solution is going to be having a new driveshaft made. > > >> > > >> Now, my rear driveshaft is a slightly different story. It is nice and tight, > > >> still has it's original U-joints at 235,000 miles. It was at last check > > >> exactly 3/8 of an inch too short. After spending some quality time with the > > >> tape measure I determined that the centering pin in my leaf springs was back > > >> about 3/4 of an inch from where it was on my last set of leaf springs. I also > > >> decided that at full compression I was going to have tire in my sheet metal. > > >> So after a lot of thinking about it...where I have had leaf springs crack in > > >> the past (not on the spring perch), and that a round hole doesn't really make > > >> very bad stress concentrations anyway; I decided to disassemble the spring > > >> packs and re-drill the top three leaves and re-assemble the spring packs. A > > >> quick check of the internet says I am not the only person to have done this, > > >> and Apparently it has been done with success in the past. So I proceeded to > > >> spend the better part of a weekend drilling holes, one side is done, and the > > >> other side I have two more drill sizes to go through on the passenger side > > >> though. Lot of thread cutting oil, and you pretty much have to sharpen the > > >> drill bit every 1/16th of an inch or so. So maybe this is my weekend to move > > >> the Jeep under it's own power. > > >> > > >> Been working a ton of hours which pays for the project, but doesn't give time > > >> for it. > > >> > > >> Mark > > >> 81 Wag > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your > > > inbox. > > > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL :en-US:WM_HMP:042010_2= > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the too busy. Combine all your e-mail accounts with Hotmail. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?tile=multiaccount&ocid=PID2832 6::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_4 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2010 05:21:39 +0000 From: Michel Balea Subject: RE: fsj: Making a mess of tranny fluid Reviving an old thread to take the mess out of a spill. I was contemplating the vacuum or suction method that appears on some of the foreign car boards. Basically the same technique used to siphon oil from boat engines. A big canister is equipped with a pump to create vacuum and a small hose is inserted in the dipstick opening. It probably takes a while to drain 8 quarts, but for our transmission with a large mouth dipstick, this seems like the ideal solution for a price of $60ish..... could be used for the differential as well. But beware that the tubes seem to be sensitive to heat, some reports melting the tube, so a copper tubing could be better. Here we go, I do not own the model listed, but the forum was referenced after a search for a vacuum method, this is an entertaining 7 page rant. http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371807 I use an electrical vacuum pump to clean the bottom of the oil pan every other oil change or when I feel like it after dumping a cup of MMO, it cleans the suction hose and the remaining waste. In fact draining the oil pan out of the 85 is rather messy as the drain plug is facing the front diff, what were they thinking of. Michel 74 and 85 FSJs > To: fsj-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: Making a mess of tranny fluid > Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2010 15:18:09 -0400 > From: wallacem7-at-aol.com > > Drain the tranny before you even consider taking it out. One time, many many > years ago I decided that draining the tranny was 'too much work' so I pulled > the T-case and pulled the engine with the tranny. The tranny output shaft's > seal is in the T-Case if I remember correctly and I made an enormous mess of > transmission fluid. No big deal right...just put down some speedy dry and > continue to work. Only speedy dry, and tranny fluid in your shirt makes a very > itchy combination. I think I was changing my shirt three times a day during > that little job. I reinstalled the trans with an aluminum deep finned pan with > a drain plug. Same goes for the T-case, drain that before it comes out as > well. > > I need to service the trans on my Dakota right now and it still has the > original tranny pan on it. I went to the Pep Boys to get a big oil drain pain > and they had a whole lot of nothing. I think I'll get one of the little > concrete mixing tubs at the Home Despot or Lowes...more than big enough and > then I can clean it up and mix cement in it later . They are polyethylene so > no chemicals (Diesel, gas, MEK, trannny fluid) should attack the plastic. > > You can pull a valve body with the trans in the truck...probably the easiest > way to do it. On the TF 727 access to some of the pan bolts is not great, but > it's easy enough to pull the crossmember and set the trans on a jackstand. I'd > put the whole Jeep on jackstands...if I remember correctly when you pull the > valve body you lose 'park' Changing the trans fluid and adjusting the bands is > something that needs to be done from time to time to get a long life out of > the trans anyway. > > Mark Wallace > 81 Wag _________________________________________________________________ The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL :en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3 ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #3597 **************************