From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Fri May 12 17:35:58 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Friday, May 12 2000 Volume 01 : Number 851 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [Re: fsj: Oddities on the Wagoneer] Re: [fsj: Miles to the Gallon] fsj: Re: Window Electric Window Gears Re: fsj: Re: Window Electric Window Gears fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? fsj: wires, meters and holes in the roof Re: fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? Re: fsj: wires, meters and holes in the roof Re: fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? fsj: NEC fsj: Miles to the Gallon fsj: Starter question... fsj: Re: full size fsj: Re: Re: full size fsj: Re: Re: full size fsj: what I meant to type... FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 12 May 00 12:14:16 MDT From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [Re: fsj: Oddities on the Wagoneer] Dan Black wrote: > jeepnut said: > {- What year is your SJ? Poking around the book tonite and noticed an = IS note > {- on '86 model year for a "mild surge or engine speed variation while > {- driving"....on the 5.9l engine... > {- Power Valve Vacumn Circuit gets rerouted to a better vacumn source. > {- Let me know if you (or others) need details. > = > '88. I'd be happy to know more if it still happened in '88. Absolutely--would be interested to find out if my 86 has the proper routi= ng or not... even if I haven't really noticed the problem. Michael - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 ------------------------------ Date: 12 May 00 12:42:37 MDT From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [fsj: Miles to the Gallon] Chris Sutton wrote: > What is a resonable expectation for gas milage in this setup? Now = > mileage varies from 8 to 10 MPG. = Actually I see this come up ALL the time on all the lists I'm on. I have= n't ever taken a real survey. But my general impression is that 8-10mpg for = a QT-equipped, 360-powered rig isn't too awful. I wouldn't be surprised if= you could get it up a little more if someone tunes up carb etc very carefully= and gets everything dialed in just right. That's assuming the motor is in go= od condition. The part-time/full-time GWs seem capable of doing 12-14mpg ci= ty depending on condition and tune. My 86 is currently doing about 10-11, b= ut I suspect a lot of that is poorly tuned carb (thanx to me) and tired motor.= Michael - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 11:41:52 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Window Electric Window Gears olympic 4x4 in snohomish (they have a toll free number) would be able to get it. the dealer might have it, but $!$ :) I'll cc this to the fsj list too... john On Fri, 12 May 2000 PNReason-at-aol.com wrote: >-->John: >-->I have a 1986 Jeep Grand Wagoneer. I am in need of the electric window motor >-->gear that is driven by the electric motor worm gear that intern drives the >-->window gear strap that raises and lowers the window in the left front door. >-->Jeep dealers don't have a part number for it and say I must buy the entire >-->assembly, which I don't need. Do you know of anyone who might help me find >-->this gear. >-->Thank you! >--> >-->Sincerely, >-->Phillip N. Reasoner >-->pnreason-at-aol.com >-->941-277-0044 >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 14:04:35 -0500 From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Re: Window Electric Window Gears {- On Fri, 12 May 2000 PNReason-at-aol.com wrote: {- I have a 1986 Jeep Grand Wagoneer. I am in need of the electric {- window motor gear that is driven by the electric motor worm gear that {- intern drives the window gear strap that raises and lowers the window {- in the left front door. Jeep dealers don't have a part number for it {- and say I must buy the entire assembly, which I don't need. Do you {- know of anyone who might help me find this gear. Has anybody compared the door guts to those of a late 80s Dodge Caravan? I ask because the plastic toothed strap that runs on the gears is the same between at least the later FSJs and the late 80s Caravans (among other Dodges, probably). My mom's '89 Caravan kept stripping them out, so my dad got a couple/few from a dealer, and ended up with an extra. So when mine went out in a GWag (I think it was the '84 that Bruce has now, else the '85), we just cut it to the right length and it went in perfectly. (And the way the trannies went out, you should be able to find more decent parts from Caravan bodies than you can count in any junkyard.) As a sidenote, another thing those two vehicles shared was the overhead console. The one they put in the GWags starting in '89 is exactly the same as the Caravan from that year and surrounding years. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- They're only trying to make me LOOK paranoid. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 12:00:27 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? On Fri, 12 May 2000, Ray Salinas wrote: Ray Salinas >-->John, >--> >-->I've been boning up on Jeep Grand Wagoneers by visiting all the web sites I >-->can find. I've decided to buy one ('84-'91) but I want it to be in >-->excellent condition. The Wagonmaster (www.wagonmaster.com) has some nice >-->ones but, his prices are way high compared to blue book and conventional >-->wisdom. Any advice on what is a fair price for one with low miles and well >-->maintained? >--> >-->Any other advice? I live in the Omaha area (that's in Nebraska). >--> >--> >-->Ray Salinas prices are all over the map, depending on condition, the owner, location and so on... wagonmasters has been tried by one of the guys on the FSJ list and my math calculations on bringing an FSJ to full service is pretty close to what they're asking... ...sometimes you get what you pay for... :) john ====================================================================================== To subscribe to a list on digest.net, EMAIL majordomo-at-digest.net, no subject needed, in the body: subscribe [ fsj | xj | diesel-benz ] end (note: select only one of the options in the brackets) You will need to reply to an authentication message. Add a "-digest" to any of the lists to subscribe in the digest mode (messages are grouped, less traffic). Please do not send HTML, special characters, images, SPAM, attachments or stylized text to the lists. The "FOUR" List Rules: 1) NO flames. 2) NO foul language. 3) keep it Family oriented. 4) keep the subject list oriented. to post, email [xj | fsj | diesel-benz]-at-digest.net to unsubscribe, email majordomo-at-digest.net in the message: unsubscribe (list name) (your email) end ====================================================================================== john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/FSJ_filters.html http://www.wagoneers.com/book-info.html http://www.wagoneers.com/BIBLE ====================================================================================== ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 12:11:34 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: wires, meters and holes in the roof wires, meters and holes in the roof... 1) wire has a positive temperature coefficient... the hotter it gets the higher it's resistance, the higher the resistance, the hotter it gets... until the resistance limits the current or you have a meltdown. In transistor design you have to design limits to the circuit to avoid a thing called thermal runaway... 2) I like the idea of replacing the ammeter with a voltmeter. jim blair mentioned a part that will bolt right in from another rig... maybe he'll remember and send a nice short message with just that info. Then we could replace the ammeter with a voltmeter and then short the leads going to the amp gauge together on both ends and have a nice point to measure the voltage... I'd recommend putting a thermal breaker, fuse or fusible link as close to the alternator as possible... I'll write up something on this and take pictures for an upcoming article... 3) holes in the roof... What, are you guys nuts welding the holes up? You'll sell the rig and someone will want to put the rack back on and you'll have been promoted instantly to DSPO. Don't weld 'em, plug 'em with the body plugs and silicon... leave the options open, but plug the hole. ;) that's all... john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 14:32:31 -0500 From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? On Fri, 12 May 2000, Ray Salinas Ray Salinas said: >-->I've been boning up on Jeep Grand Wagoneers by visiting all the web sites I >-->can find. I've decided to buy one ('84-'91) but I want it to be in >-->excellent condition. The Wagonmaster (www.wagonmaster.com) has some nice >-->ones but, his prices are way high compared to blue book and conventional >-->wisdom. Any advice on what is a fair price for one with low miles and well >-->maintained? John said: {- prices are all over the map, depending on condition, the owner, location and {- so on... wagonmasters has been tried by one of the guys on the FSJ list and {- my math calculations on bringing an FSJ to full service is pretty close to {- what they're asking... {- ...sometimes you get what you pay for... :) I'm "that guy", BTW. Just wanted to point out something to remember: You're actually not paying for the year on a car, you're paying for the mileage. Most vehicles really do get 10K+ miles/year, and after 80-100K miles, it doesn't really matter anymore, so you really don't see much variation, esp. with non-sports cars. But it does make a difference. My brother got a '95 Cherokee right around the same time as I got my '88 GWag (from Wagonmasters). Each had about 43K miles on them. Both were in similar condition, inside and out, which is to say very nice, almost brand-new condition. The GWag might've been slightly more expensive (including inflation) brand new, but they were probably fairly similar. And both were ~$15K. The fact that his was four years old and mine was eleven years old didn't make any difference as far as the market is concerned. Having said that, I do think he's raised his prices $2-3K over the last couple years, but I think (and hope) they won't go up much more. And I still think they're worth it, because as John said, you _will_ put that much into any other one if you truly want it in that same condition, inside and out. It's also nice not having to shovel more money into maintenance every other month. I've replaced a U-joint and the power steering return hose since I got it, and those are the only required fixes I've had. (I also put on brand new snow tires; and there's now a pinhole leak in the radiator, which I plan to just replace because I got really sick of any kind of cooling problem in a previous FSJ -- easier to just replace it and never worry about the problem again -- and despite spilling a few cups of coolant every week or two, it still hasn't even thought about overheating. But those are options that I'm paying more for because of my preference.) So my advice is that if you have the money and don't want to go through the trouble of fixing it up yourself (or worrying about lots of maintenance along the way), Wagonmasters is a great option. For those who didn't know or figure it out, Wagonmasters is at both http://www.wagonmasters.com/ and http://www.wagonmaster.com/ (in case y'all get confused ;) ). - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Boldly going nowhere. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 13:23:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: wires, meters and holes in the roof A: I'll have to dig through my website. (I think that's where I put it. Haven't been keeping up on it lately) I vaguely recall it being a GM part. John wrote: 2) I like the idea of replacing the ammeter with a voltmeter. jim blair mentioned a part that will bolt right in from another rig... maybe he'll remember and send a nice short message with just that info. =A0 Then we could replace the ammeter with a voltmeter and then short the leads going to the amp gauge together on both ends and have a nice point to measure the voltage... I'd recommend putting a thermal breaker, fuse or fusible link as close to the alternator as possible... I'll write up something on this and take pictures for an upcoming article... (snip) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=3D13998&Auth=3Dfalse ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 13:26:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Re: WHAT ARE THESE WORTH? A: There is an '88 GW nearby that has new motor trans and TC the owner is selling for $4000 because he lost his job. Haven't seen it yet, but I will (thought about replacing Elmo with it). On Fri, 12 May 2000, Ray Salinas wrote: =A0=A0Ray Salinas John, I've been boning up on Jeep Grand Wagoneers by visiting all the web sites I can find. I've decided to buy one ('84-'91) but I want it to be in excellent condition. The Wagonmaster (www.wagonmaster.com) has some nice ones but, his prices are way high compared to blue book and conventional wisdom. Any advice on what is a fair price for one with low miles and well maintained? Any other advice? I live in the Omaha area (that's in Nebraska). Ray Salinas prices are all over the map, depending on condition, the owner, location and so on... wagonmasters has been tried by one of the guys on the FSJ list and my math calculations on bringing an FSJ to full service is pretty close to what they're asking... ...sometimes you get what you pay for... :) john ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=3D13998&Auth=3Dfalse ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 17:05:00 -0400 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: NEC JeepNut writes: Oops, this is really screwed-up. Oh well...Jamie, I looked at the RV maintenance manual while woofing down a bowl of cereal this morning an= d it referenced section 551 of the NEC handbook. Does that jive with the '99 handbook? Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 12-May-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 17:04:58 -0400 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: Miles to the Gallon Chris Sutton writes: >> all stock, 360, t400,2 barrel carb,(2150?) << Chris, Welcome. You likely have a 2100 carb. Unless someone retrofitted a 2150. 2150s showed-up on Jeeps in '78 or '79. Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 12-May-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 17:04:59 -0400 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: Starter question... JeepNut writes: >> Mine won't quit. Anybody had this? The silly thing will start cranking but I can let off the key and it keeps cranking until it starts,= or sometimes it'll cough and not start, but the point is that the starter= seems to stop "driving" as soon as the truck starts to act like it's gonn= a start. So I'm lost. << Sounds like the Bendix to me. I'm not sure if you have the Ford starter o= r the Mitsubishi gear-reduction starter? The change-over occurred right around '88. If you have the Ford starter, James; for one, might be able t= o tell you how to change just the Bendix. Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 12-May-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 14:12:32 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: full size >--> On Sat, 13 May 2000, Mike Wilson wrote: Mike Wilson >--> >--> john, am in australia and have been looking at your page for >--> quite a while as I have been interseted in this style jeep, >--> they are known as ft boys out here the same as some of the harleys. >--> I have found one locally that I am going to make an offer on >--> this morning.It looks similar colour scheme as yours,dark brown >--> up top and a goldy colour below ,sounds gruesome but the two >--> toning really suits.She has just had the motor 360 v8 re-cond >--> and the auto .Wiring has just been re-newed and has just been resprayed. >--> I know the vehicle and the owner who has treated her like a baby. >--> She is an 85 model out here,the last shapr before they shrunk.I >--> require her for a towing vehicle for a 30' houseboat,so I am limited >--> in what vehicle is availableLandcruisers,patrols don't seem to have >--> enough power for the hills and for the same year are about twice the price. >--> F series fords and inters in 4x4 again are to dear as well as offering >--> little comfort which we need as both the wife and I have buggered backs. >--> This vehicle also uses lpg which would bring the travelling expeses >--> down a little bit. >--> The asking price was originally $15,000 aus and has now drpped >--> to$11,000 or offer which is about $6000 your money,it is a little bit >--> dearer than average out here,but is in immaculate condition. >--> I am going to try $9k and hope that I am succesful if so will send >--> photo's if not I will keep looking until I find another fat boy,they >--> to me have a great fasination about them. >--> Mike Wilson Byron Bay I've heard of folks dropping 2,000 to 3,000 USD on an engine rebuild in these rigs. So if this rig has a good body and a fresh engine, It might even get 6,000 USD here too. The LPG setup is also a major plus. Using LPG will help that engine last a lot longer too. If you get it you'll have to send me some pictures. :) Fat Boy's, huh? ;) btw, I'll cc this to the FSJ list and include instructions on how to get on the list... you will need to send plain text messages though. :) ttyl, john - ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ====================================================================================== To subscribe to a list on digest.net, EMAIL majordomo-at-digest.net, no subject needed, in the body: subscribe [ fsj | xj | diesel-benz ] end (note: select only one of the options in the brackets) You will need to reply to an authentication message. Add a "-digest" to any of the lists to subscribe in the digest mode (messages are grouped, less traffic). Please do not send HTML, special characters, images, SPAM, attachments or stylized text to the lists. The "FOUR" List Rules: 1) NO flames. 2) NO foul language. 3) keep it Family oriented. 4) keep the subject list oriented. to post, email [xj | fsj | diesel-benz]-at-digest.net to unsubscribe, email majordomo-at-digest.net in the message: unsubscribe (list name) (your email) end ====================================================================================== john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/FSJ_filters.html http://www.wagoneers.com/book-info.html http://www.wagoneers.com/BIBLE ====================================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 16:10:06 -0600 From: "Kim Smith" Subject: fsj: Re: Re: full size > If you get it you'll have to send me some pictures. :) Fat Boy's, huh? ;) Good thing with my physique I don't live in Oz, 'cause then my Waggy would be "Fat Boy's Fat Boy"! I'm what the Big/Tall men's shops call a "Man of Dimension" In my case, should be a "Man of Dementia" kim '80 Wagoneer "J0E", 360 v2,T-727,NP219 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 15:10:18 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Re: full size when I married my wife she mentioned that she didn't want to marry someone short, fat and bald... rofl... at the time I was only short... (i'm not really "fat", there is just about 20lbs more of me than there should be... or is it because I'm undertall by about 15 inches? ;) john On Fri, 12 May 2000, Kim Smith wrote: >-->> If you get it you'll have to send me some pictures. :) Fat Boy's, huh? >-->;) >--> >-->Good thing with my physique I don't live in Oz, 'cause then my >-->Waggy would be "Fat Boy's Fat Boy"! I'm what the Big/Tall men's >-->shops call a "Man of Dimension" In my case, should be a >-->"Man of Dementia" >--> >-->kim >-->'80 Wagoneer "J0E", 360 v2,T-727,NP219 >--> >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 17:06:46 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: what I meant to type... what I meant to type... was fuel injected... 'cause I don't remember what chebby calls the squirters on Whit's LT motor... all I know is it sounded really nice and looked like it came from the factory as installed. I still think the 4.0L is the best way of going... :) Hey somebody want to explain, or list exactly what's needed to make one of these stroker motors? Is it a 258 crank with the 4.0L block, head and normal fuel injection setup? Which rods are used? don't forget that Sunday would NOT be a good day to go wheeling or working on your rig... UNLESS "she" is actively involved and interested in doing so... ;) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #851 *************************